UNUS MUNDUS

The UNUS MUNDUS forum of Psychovision (Remo F. Roth) invites discussion of theoretical and practical issues of a possible union of Carl Jung's depth psychology with quantum physical principles.
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 Small-minded/ Sieve 
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Joined: Thu Jul 22, 2010 10:22 pm
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Location: UK
Post Small-minded/ Sieve
Dream: I am at the top of a stair. I hear a female voice say to me “Malcolm thinks you are small-minded.” At this comment I see that I am holding a small sieve and clear water has just drained through it so that it will fall onto the higher steps of the stair. I see nothing in the sieve itself.

Associations.

Malcolm is a personal a friend, thinks broadly, but he is not too bright. (Not sure that he is a subjective Shadow figure in this dream, maybe he is to be interpreted objectively.)

Top of stairs: Indicates inflation of ego. “Small-minded” seems to oppose this.

Sieve: I use one often to wash grapes.

Sieve: Alchemy/Filtration? (My knowledge poor here.)

Sieve: The phrase “sieve his proper worth” in Kipling’s poem “Tomlinson”, Tomlinson having died, having his soul weighed, denied entry to both heaven and hell for having “no soul of his own.”

Thoughts welcome

“Tomlinson” here btw:

http://www.poetryloverspage.com/poets/k ... inson.html


Wed Oct 31, 2012 7:35 pm
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Post Re: Small-minded/ Sieve
Hi Rob,

at first glance, it would seem to me that 'mesh' is a factor, and therefore 'holes'. Somehow I get the idea that 'Wholly Water' spilled at the top of the stair makes for a slippery slope - to degeneration. On the flip side, there is something to be said about the wet path - and 'treading' with caution :)

kind regards,
pascal

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Wed Oct 31, 2012 8:23 pm
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Post Re: Small-minded/ Sieve
Thanks pascal,

Always helpful to get a new fresh pair of eyes. I missed "wholly water", "slippery slope" and "treading with caution".

Aha, do I recall from somewhere the "wet path" and "dry path" in Alchemy? Yes, I think so. Will do my research.

Regards

Rob


Wed Oct 31, 2012 8:35 pm
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Location: Lyon, France
Post Re: Small-minded/ Sieve
Rob,

My hypothesis:

If Malcom is not too bright, he could be a symbol for the eros consciousness. The opposite of small-minded is open-minded.
In my last post, I relate a dream of a poet: my hypothesis is that the dream wants to show that the logos (Cambridge) hurts the eros (fox)
Sieve=logos
Water=unconscious

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Wed Oct 31, 2012 10:58 pm
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Post Re: Small-minded/ Sieve
Thanks fox,

In a vague kinda way that could make sense to me.

Rob


Wed Oct 31, 2012 11:58 pm
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Post Re: Small-minded/ Sieve
I think my hypothesis was wrong...sorry.
Small-minded is something positive.
I read the last post of Gregory, so top of stairs is not inflation.

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There are those that look at things the way they are, and ask why? I dream of things that never were, and ask why not? ( Robert Kennedy quoting George Bernard Shaw )


Thu Nov 01, 2012 1:12 am
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Post Re: Small-minded/ Sieve
Or maybe not?

"Small minded" might be "small thinking". So where is the big? in Feeling.


Thu Nov 01, 2012 10:05 am
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Post Of Mice & Men
I immediately flashback to John Steinbeck's novel Of Mice And Men (1937) who also wrote The Grapes Of Wrath (1939) when I read your dream at the start of this thread. Strange that the story begins during the Great Depression in Weed, California where I live!
Attachment:
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Quote:
Two migrant field workers in California on their plantation during the Great Depression - George Milton, an intelligent but uneducated man, and Lennie Small, a man of large stature and great strength but limited mental abilities—are on their way to another part of California in Soledad. They hope to one day attain their shared dream of settling down on their own piece of land. Lennie's part of the dream is merely to tend to (and touch) soft rabbits on the farm. This dream is one of Lennie's favorite stories, which George constantly retells. They are fleeing from their previous employment in Weed, California, where they were run out of town after Lennie's love of stroking soft things resulted in an accusation of attempted rape when he touched a young woman's dress, and would not let go. It soon becomes clear that the two are close friends and George is Lennie's protector. The theme of friendship is constant throughout the story.

It seems Fox has picked up on the right "scent" given his earlier post above for Lennie would represent Eros ego consciousness for the realization of the alchemical Christ.

Gregory


Thu Nov 01, 2012 8:32 pm
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Post Re: Small-minded/ Sieve
Thanks Gregory,

“Grapes of Wrath” is new to me, and I have not read “of Mice and Men” either. I’m fairly backward in literature, but did read Steinbeck’s “The Pearl” a couple of years ago, in connection with the Gnostic Sophia, as I recall.

But interesting that I associate the dream to another personal friend, “Lenny”, wrath and eros consciousness at the forefront with these two of recent.

And, apologies, I hadn’t realised Weed was an actual place.

To a Mouse

Small, crafty, cowering, timorous little beast,
O, what a panic is in your little breast!
You need not start away so hasty
With argumentative chatter!
I would be loath to run and chase you,
With murdering plough-staff.
I'm truly sorry man's dominion
Has broken Nature's social union,
And justifies that ill opinion
Which makes you startle
At me, your poor, earth born companion
And fellow mortal!
I doubt not, sometimes, but you may steal;
What then? Poor little beast, you must live!
An odd ear in twenty-four sheaves
Is a small request;
I will get a blessing with what is left,
And never miss it.
Your small house, too, in ruin!
Its feeble walls the winds are scattering!
And nothing now, to build a new one,
Of coarse grass green!
And bleak December's winds coming,
Both bitter and keen!
You saw the fields laid bare and wasted,
And weary winter coming fast,
And cozy here, beneath the blast,
You thought to dwell,
Till crash! the cruel plough passed
Out through your cell.
That small bit heap of leaves and stubble,
Has cost you many a weary nibble!
Now you are turned out, for all your trouble,
Without house or holding,
To endure the winter's sleety dribble,
And hoar-frost cold.
But little Mouse, you are not alone,
In proving foresight may be vain:
The best laid schemes of mice and men
Go often awry,

And leave us nothing but grief and pain,
For promised joy!
Still you are blest, compared with me!
The present only touches you:
But oh! I backward cast my eye,
On prospects dreary!
And forward, though I cannot see,
I guess and fear!

Robert Burns


Thu Nov 01, 2012 10:17 pm
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Post Re: Small-minded/ Sieve
I wonder if the sieve is a moon symbol?

Prompted to this thought by reading Edinger's "The Mysterium Lectures", pages 40 to 43.


Sun Nov 04, 2012 12:19 pm
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Post Re: Small-minded/ Sieve
Hi Rob,

the mesh idea was meant to mean a 'matrix'. I had envisioned 'degeneration' as having some entropy reference. But really, I don't know much about that. Either way, I find it curious that the sieve and matrix share something in common. Being cautious with the waters might lend its way to that kind of connectivity / gravity.

I hope you don't mind my 2 cents :)


pascal

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Mon Nov 05, 2012 3:50 am
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Post Re: Small-minded/ Sieve
Pascal, your 2 cents much appreciated.

Also, thanks for the clarification on mesh as matrix and degeneration, helpful.

(A friend just told me how he has recently seen a picture of Queen Elizabeth I holding a sieve. )

I can’t pin this one down in thought but my intuition is telling me that you are on the right track.

My intuition is also telling me to add this more general thought:

When I have my own confrontations with the unconscious, which hit me suddenly and hard, and last six months or more, I physically lose weight. Is this my body matrix degenerating, fuelling the archetypes, matter becoming mind etc.? Vague and speculating here.

Regards

Rob


Mon Nov 05, 2012 9:18 am
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Post Re: Small-minded/ Sieve
Hi Rob,

when you wrote about fueling archetypes I had an instant association with something Roger has written about here (and maybe elsewhere). When you talk about being drained in that way, I see that vampire idea quite clear. Something that really struck me about this was when my daughter, who is 4, asked me if there are 'real people vampires'. This was just a couple of days ago, so the theme was already present for me. I guess I could be letting that trickle into this thread, dunno :)

But, as I re-read this, I see something about balance. Perhaps a magnetic draw of sorts?

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Mon Nov 05, 2012 4:13 pm
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Post Re: Small-minded/ Sieve
Pascal, I think you may have tapped into my own recent Jungian cogitations somehow. Ideas of balance and magnet fields have figured in them.

(I had the vampire dreams three years ago. Two female ones, twins, bit into my neck, I felt my energy draining away.)

A short nap and my own dream response:

I see two people. I sense them as researchers or explorers. They are dressed “post-apocalyptic” style (as in films), covered head to foot, faces too, in black ragged clothes, against the weather conditions. I see them on a sand dune ridge, some vegetation here. And yet also I sense that this is a polar region.

They take time out for a wash before the last leg of their expedition. Their washing (and I watch it as if taking a tip) is to use lemon juice, lard and port wine, mixed until they produce fire, this then used as abrasive type cleaner. I sense it as a meal too. The method is used on a small part of one of their black over-trousers, below the left knee. Now I focus in and I see the fire burning through what looks like black canker on a kitchen cooker hob. Underneath I see white enamel emerging. The black is burning away, the white enamel showing through. The fire is also maybe getting underneath the enamel.

I “want some of this” and have left my own meal aside. It consists of mashed potato, flat semi-circular dollop on the plate, green peas and three sausages, still frying in frying pan. These two help themselves.

Rob


Mon Nov 05, 2012 8:33 pm
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Post Re: Small-minded/ Sieve
Hi Rob,

that was an intense description! Those dark characters reminded me of some sort of guardians. Maybe the fire that they wash in is the 'point / port' between 'here' and the place they are guardians of. I took some liberty with that idea, but it felt right :)

The mixture of the bathing solution sounds to me like elements...that would eventually flow into a stream.


pascal

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Tue Nov 06, 2012 5:53 pm
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Post Re: Small-minded/ Sieve
Yes, pascal, guardians, of course. Isn’t every dream figure?

I now have another three too – three six year-old girls, hand in hand, the last in line taking hands with me.

I do like “animal, vegetable, mineral” here for lard, lemon, and abrasive, and port wine as “spirit”.

Will continue my opus. :lol:

Rob


Tue Nov 06, 2012 7:12 pm
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