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 9/11/2010: Bush and Bin Laden -- Two Terrorists 
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Post 9/11/2010: Bush and Bin Laden -- Two Terrorists
Today, a new Internet Journal written in German has been opened, which tries to be like Huffinton Post. See http://journal21.ch/auch-bush-hat-viel- ... ngerichtet .

One of the most important experts on the Near East in the German culture is Arnold Hottinger. In the first number of today, 9/11, he wrote the following. Unfortunately it is in German. He says that Bush is at least as responsible for the tensions between the West and the Islamic culture as Bin Laden.

Here the article in German.

Quote:
Auch Bush hat viel Unheil angerichtet
Unnötige Kriege im Irak und in Afghanistan
11. September 2001

Die "Achse des Bösen", die Osama bin Laden am 11. September 2001 in Gang gesetzt hat, dreht sich weiter. Präsident Bush hat mächtig zur Eskalierung beigetragen. Obama gelang es zwar, die Lage leicht zu entspannen. Doch es ist schwierig, dem heraufbeschworenen Bösen Einhalt zu gebieten.

Es gibt zwei Hauptschuldige für das, was nach dem 11. September geschah. Osama bin Laden war der Auslöser der Untat. Jedenfalls hat er selbst triumphierend die Verantwortung dafür übernommen. Doch Präsident George W. Bush hat den Anschlag dazu benutzt, einen doppelten Krieg auszulösen – im Irak und in Afghanistan. Zwei Kriege, die eigentlich unnötig und kontraproduktiv sind. Dafür muss Bush die Verantwortung tragen. Durch geheimpolizeiliche, diplomatische und finanzpolitische Massnahmen wäre man vielleicht weitergekommen.

Bush hat mehr Unheil heraufbeschworen als die Terroristen

Doch Bush wollte Krieg führen, aber er führte ihn erfolglos. In Afghanistan gehen die Kämpfe weiter, im Irak herrscht nach wie vor Gewalt und Terror, und Bin Laden wurde nicht gefasst. Bush hat mehr Unheil heraufbeschworen, als die Terroristen des 11. September. Würde man die beiden Untaten quantifizieren, so müsste man feststellen: Die Terroristen töteten 10 000 Menschen. Doch auf das Konto von Bush und seinen falschen Propaganda-Behauptungen gehen Hunderttausende von Todesopfern und Schwerverletzten, sowie Zehntausende von Flüchtlingen. Ein grosser Teil der 60 Millionen Menschen, die im Irak und in Afghanistan leben, leiden unter den Kriegsfolgen.

Ungerechtfertigte Islam-Hetze

Der Terroranschlag vom 11. September kostete die USA mehrere Milliarden Dollar. Doch der Irak-Krieg verschlang ein Mehrfaches. Laut den Berechnungen von Nobelpreisträger Joseph Stiglitz kostete der Irak-Krieg bis 2008 einzig und allein die USA mehr als drei Trillionen Dollar. Dazu wurde eine weltweite Islam-Hetze ausgelöst, deren Folgen nicht abzusehen sind. Ein Hetze, die nach dem Urteil aller Einsichtigen ungerechtfertigt ist. Das Image der USA wurde befleckt. Die untilgbaren Schandflecken heissen Guantanamo, Abu Ghraib und "rendition".

Die Lüge von den Massenvernichtungswaffen

Für jene westlichen Menschen, die von der Globalisierung profitieren, ist Bin Laden der Hauptschuldige und Auslöser der heutigen Zustände. Doch für die Mehrheit der Leute, die unter der Globalisierung mehr leiden als profitieren, ist George W. Bush der Verantwortliche. Er gilt als der Fortsetzer, als jener, der zwei Kriege ungerechtfertigt und erfolglos geführt hat – und damit viel Unheil über die Welt gebracht hat. Keiner der beiden mutmasslichen Verbrecher ist bisher vor ein Gericht gestellt worden.

In die Arme der Terroristen getrieben

Beide Seiten haben ihre Untaten rechtfertigen wollen. Dazu führten sie Vorwände und Scheinbegründungen ins Feld. Die USA behaupteten zunächst, Saddam Hussein besitze Massenvernichtungswaffen. Diese Lüge ist dann aufgeflogen. Immer wieder beschworen die USA den Terrorismus als grösste Gefahr für die Welt. Ihr blinder Kampf gegen alles Verdächtige provozierte Elend, Wut und Hoffnungslosigkeit. Dies führt dazu, dass immer mehr junge Leute in die Arme der Terroristen getrieben wurden. In Lagern werden sie als Bombenbauer und Selbstmordattentäter ausgebildet.

Verlust der muslimischen Ehre

Auf der andern Seite sieht sich Osama bin Laden als Kämpfer im Heiligen Krieg. Als solcher setzt er sich gerne in Szene. Doch auch das ist nur ein Vorwand zur Selbstrechtfertigung. Alle Religionen können pervertiert werden, der Islam und alle andern. Die Religion, die Osama beschwört, ist ein pervertierter, ideologisch entstellter Islam.

Was hat Osama dazu veranlasst, seine Religion zu entstellen? Und was trieb Bush dazu, unbedingt Krieg führen zu wollen, wo doch eine Polizeiaktion angebrachter gewesen wäre?

Darüber sind bereits viele Bücher veröffentlicht worden: voll von Enthüllungen, Behauptungen und Vermutungen. Wichtige Fragen werden gestellt. Doch nur wenn sie richtig beantwortet werden, können wir aus dem geschehenen Unrecht lernen. Werden sie falsch beantwortet, besteht die Gefahr, dass sich die Verbrechen wiederholen. Im Fall von bin Laden geht es nicht um den Islam. Es geht um die Frage, weshalb er entstellt wurde. Es ging nicht um Geld, denn Osama war reich. Auch ging es nicht um fehlende Möglichkeiten der Selbstverwirklichung. Um was ging es dann? Der muslimische Anthropologe Akbar S. Ahmed spricht vom "Verlust der Ehre". Manche der heutigen Muslime empfinden, dass sie ihre Würde, ihr Mitspracherecht, ihre eigene Stimme verloren haben.

Du bist ein Kämpfer im Heiligen Krieg

Damit ist wohl das gemeint, was Menschen, die ausserhalb des Islams stehen, als Identitätsverlust oder Identitätskrise der Muslime bezeichnen. Also ein Orientierungsverlust. Die eigene, muslimische Kultur wurde massiv beeinflusst durch fremde, westliche und weltweit erfolgreiche Werte und Massstäbe. Viele Muslime stellten sich deshalb die Frage: "Wer bin ich denn noch? Was kann ich tun, um mich selbst zu bewahren?" Das treibt gewisse Muslime dazu, ihre Religion defensiv oder gar entstellt auszulegen.

Islamistische Ideologen ermutigen, beruhigen und bestätigen sie in ihren radikalen Vorstellungen: "Du bist ein Kämpfer für den Islam im Heiligen Krieg! Das ist deine Lebensaufgabe und der Zweck deines Lebens!"

Präsident Bush – „wenig gebildet, hilflos, ausgelacht

Bei Bush liegen die Dinge ähnlich. Er sah plötzlich die Möglichkeit, eine grosse Rolle zu spielen. Er, der verwöhnte und verzogene Präsidenten-Sohn, der zwischen Alkoholismus und fundamentalistisch christlichen Wiedergeburts-Gedanken schwankte. Er auch, der zu Beginn seiner Amtszeit als wenig gebildeter und ziemlich hilfloser Präsident eher ausgelacht wurde. Jetzt sah er die Möglichkeit, jemand von Gewicht und Würde zu sein. Deshalb wollte er den Krieg, um sich selbst zu bestätigen. Jetzt war er der "Oberkommandierende im Krieg gegen den Terrorismus".

Andere Motive und Einflüsse kamen dazu. Eine kriegstreibende Rolle spielte die amerikanische Erdölindustrie, die echte oder vermeintliche Sorgen um ihre Zukunft hat. Auch die Waffenindustrie trieb Bush an. Sie hat in den USA ein riesiges Gewicht. Sie wollte ihre veraltenden Todesmaschinen losbringen, um sie mit neuen, noch mehr Geld-bringenden Modellen ersetzen zu können.

Bereit standen auch die Ideologen der neokonservativen Denkrichtung. Sie fabulierten von der angeblichen Notwendigkeit, den Willen der USA auf der ganzen Welt mit militärischer Gewalt durchzusetzen. Sie waren es, die sich mit ebenso eitlen wie ehrgeizigen Spitzen der Bürokratie verbündeten. Bush war vielleicht ein ebenso Getriebener wie er selbst antrieb. Doch die Verantwortung lastet auf ihm.

Doch auch Osama bin Laden wurde angetrieben. Sein Lehrmeister war der palästinensische islamistische Agitator und Ideologe Dr. Shaikh Abdullah Azzam. Er, der tief verbittert über die von Israel vertriebenen und gedemütigten Palästinensern ist, vermittelte Osama seine islamistische Kampfideologie.

Referenzen

1. Joseph Stiglitz and Linda J Bilmes: The Three Trillion Dollar War, the true cost of the Iraq conflict, Allen Lane and Penguin 2008. Dies betrifft "nur" die Kosten für die Vereinigten Staaten, nicht jene für Irak und die für die übrige Welt.

2. "Wie können angesichts des Ansturms globaler Entwicklung lokale Kulturen ihr Gefühl für Identität und Würde bewahren? Ist die Wahrnehmung eines Verlustes an Ehre eine Folge der Desintegration von Gruppenloyalität und sozialem Zusammenhalt? Ist Gruppenloyalität, gemässigt durch humanes Mitgefühl, der Weg voran?" (nach dem englischen Text, Islam under Siege, living dangerously in a post honor world p. 14, Polity Press Cambridge 2003)

3. Über Abdullah Azzam gibt es eine ausführliche Studie von Andrew McGregor: "Jihad by the Rifle alone" Abdullah Azzam and the Islamist Revolution, Journal of Conflict Studies, fall 2003.
http://www.lib.unb.ca/Texts/JCS/Fall03/mcgregor.pdf


Remo

_________________
'Here stands the mean uncomely stone,
Tis very cheap in price!
The more it is despised by fools,
The more loved by the wise.'
(C.G. Jung, MDR, p. 253)
WebSite: http://www.paulijungunusmundus.eu


Last edited by Remo Roth on Sun Sep 12, 2010 1:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.



Sat Sep 11, 2010 3:46 pm
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Post vision of 1929
I do not know if in the UM forum, it has already discussed the vision during a Jung's seminar in 1929.

The vision : in my blog, picture of the vision of 1929 ( impossible to put directly the image in this message, the logo "overblog" appears in place of it )

http://timeisnear.over-blog.net/article-12306932.html

Jung :

( I wish the "google translation" is good )

If Yin and Yang meet, resulting in a release of energy that can be symbolized by different shapes. In the case of the dreamer, it can be an emotional energy, but this could be the explosion of a luminous revelation or inspiration of a great vision. It is interesting to see how the unconscious works in our group has already been able to anticipate the vision. I have an image taken prior to discussions by a member of our group, and thus had not been influenced by our thoughts on the union of these two symbols. This picture shows what happens when the Cross and Crescent meet. [...] Here cross, then comes the crescent. They gathered on a very singular fashion, and immediately there arose a very impressive explosion, a huge release of energy in the form of a huge sphere of light. Thus arises the phenomenon of energy. In this design, we have the theory in its totality, which says that when opposites meet there is an event of great energy in one form or another.
The light generated by the meeting of the cross and crescent speaks of an illumination, a sort of revelation. If we could bring the truth of the cross with the crescent, this would produce this illumination, combined the truth of Islam and Christianity. If the possibility existed to extract the essential truth of one and the other, and mix, then a result of this colossal enlightenment clashing that would culminate in a new conviction. >

Translator's note book: "in light of the tragic events of September 11, 2001, we can only remain confused by these words ironically prophetic Jung pronounced there are sixty-two. Jung could he imagine how far we have able to go one day out of the new "religious war" that starts before our eyes, and to achieve this combination of the cross and crescent announced that illumination has had in December 1929 a member of his seminar? "

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Sat Sep 11, 2010 10:43 pm
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Post The Lone Gunmen and the 09/11
The pilot episode is from a Boeing 727, used as a weapon intended to crash into the World Trade Center. According to the Internet Movie Database, this episode was aired in the United States March 4, 2001 [1], well before the attacks of September 11 of that year that used the same scenario.

video clip of the episode ( in english ) :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9rsMG2hH ... re=related


Sat Sep 11, 2010 11:39 pm
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Post The Clash of Logos and Eros
Thank you, fox, for this information. I did not know the vision, and I think that it was never discussed here.

If we remember that Jung was convinced that the Islam is the religion of Eros, and that Christianity had developed much too much into the principle of Logos, we realize that the vision talks also of the reunion of Logos and Eros. This reunion is already anticipated in the Hermetic alchemical motif of the coniunctio, of the sexual union of the male and the female god. It is also the general motif backing our Unus Mundus forum.

As we further know, whether the union/clash is constructive or destructive depends on the circumstance whether it is experienced consciously or unconsciously. Today, it is obvious that this deeply constellated reunion is unconscious. Thus, the opposites are constellated. War is on the program of both sides.

With my research and articles in my WebSite and in the UM forum I try to demonstrate a conscious reunion of the opposites of Logos and Eros. The symbol of this reunion is the Seal of Solomon. The method seems to be Body-Centered Imagination.

For the moment, however, I do not have too much hope anymore that this reunion becomes conscious. This means that I am in a great angst that mankind will end in the near future in a nuclear war. Since the constructive "luminous revelation and inspiration of a great vision" of mankind in more and more humans seems not to happen, we are in danger that the nuclear war will destroy us.

And this is the guilt of these two criminal terrorists!

Remo

PS: In the last vision before he passed away, Carl Jung had seen the world 50 years after his death. Most parts of it were destroyed ... Jung died in 1961!

_________________
'Here stands the mean uncomely stone,
Tis very cheap in price!
The more it is despised by fools,
The more loved by the wise.'
(C.G. Jung, MDR, p. 253)
WebSite: http://www.paulijungunusmundus.eu


Sun Sep 12, 2010 1:11 pm
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Sun Sep 12, 2010 3:06 pm

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Post Paix
"Agneau de Dieu, qui enlèves le péché du monde, prends pitié ! donne nous la Paix"...

I want to believe in this too.

Can't help but feel that inner-peace is purposely held at bay. The corporate medications there are to calm the sliver of 'us' that is out of control are tainting the waters... preventing wholeness, ignoring with force the 'opposite' - this grows out on a global scale and creates tangible enemies.

No more 'church within' - or at all for that matter.

Agneau - lamb

"The lamb is a symbol of gentleness of character and patience under suffering. It signifies purity, meekness and sacrifice. The lamb is also often borne as a symbol of Christ. The paschal or holy lamb is a lamb depicted carrying either crossed staffs, or a banner inscribed with the cross of St. George and a halo above its head. It is an emblem of faith. The holy lamb was granted to a brave, resolute spirit, who would even undertake war in Christ's cause."

Undertake war, spiritual war - not the kind that adds a certain swagger to a leader's step or walk (through bloodshed). Bring the war inside.

**I should note that a woodpecker was just pecking at my front door while I was writing this. I just sat back down to finish up...it was pecking at the door frame and let me watch it for a long time. Very cool.

"Further, the symbolic meaning of woodpecker indicates a return to our roots, or having trust in our basic (gut) feelings. Dr. Carl Jung observed the woodpecker as a symbol of a return to the womb of creativity. In this observation the tree is symbolic of a womb; earthy, grounded, sturdy and secure. The woodpecker's home within the tree is analogous of a fierce determination to return and protect that which is sacred to us."


pascal

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Sun Sep 12, 2010 7:39 pm
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Post When Cross & Crescent Meet
Fox,

Thanks for posting Jung’s 1929 Comments in which there is an energy release when the cross of Christianity and the crescent of Islam come together. You did not cite the source of this material but since I have electronic versions of Jung’s seminars on my computer I am able to find this information – it comes from the Dream Analysis Seminar (1928-1930) I had read some years ago and have now completely forgotten.

This is a timely subject as you have noted given recent events. Thus I post the larger context in which the dream and discussion appeared in the seminar so that others on the forum can follow along with the deeper meaning behind this development that seems to be heading for a climax in our time.

For me it is connected to what is also referred to as the problem of the Hostile Brothers and plays out on the world stage in that form – something that dates back to Christ and Satan, Able & Cain; Jackob & Esau,… More simply one talks about them in terms of masculine or feminine principles as Remo likes to characterize it - the challenge of uniting the Logos-Self and the Eros-Self, the causal with the acausal. Red is the customary color that can be used to identify the masculine elements (principle) of fire/air while blue is used to identify the feminine elements (principle) of water/earth. These oppo-sites release energy when united because like in fusion of the nucleus of two atoms the united state requires less energy then the separate states. That is strong nuclear force energy release – potent stuff. Not sure how that translates to the amount of energy release in a subtle body development, i.e., in the creation of a hermaphrodite made of some kind of psychophysical stuff. Clearly the latter is constructive and the former is destructive.

Now to the man’s dream Jung discussed in this seminar. There is actually a series of dreams - initial ones make reference to four chickens and a cauldron. Jung interprets this to mean that the man needs to find his individuality, his Self center via the four functions. Further, that chickens is a funny way to represent the center. I provide the following additional material to paint the larger picture – which is the repeating picture in our time – how to make contact with the inferior function; that always pulls up the other center of knowing, i.e., the preconscious knowing of the unconscious. Remo has found his BCI method helps people with this task.

Quote:
The dreamer is a business man of forty five, a good intellect, cultivated, prosperous, very polite and social, married, with three or four children; not very neurotic but "touchy"; his main trouble is that he is irritable and particularly anxious to avoid situations where some one might reproach him or hurt him. He had a pain in his stomach and felt nauseated once when the police held him up for speeding. This shows that something is not quite right. He tries to be terribly righteous, and only those who have the ability or tendency to be very wrong try to be so very right, to attain perfection; when people try to be abnormally good, something is trying to go absolutely wrong. Page 6.

In the I Ching there is a hexagram, No. 50, which is called "The Cauldron.” According to Prof. Wilhelm, a cooking pot with three legs signifies in yoga the technique for producing the new man. There is something very good in the pot, it is the meal for the king, the fat of pheasants is in it. There you have the chicken. This part of the dream suggests that the non ego centre does not really exist by itself, it has to be produced by the patient himself and with great care.

Part of the text of "The Cauldron" reads: "Fire over wood. / The image of the Cauldron. / Thus the superior man consolidates his fate / By making his position correct." . . . "A ting with legs upturned." (Everything is thrown out, then it is ready to be used.) "There is food in the ting. / My comrades are envious, / But they cannot harm me." . . . "The handle of the ting is altered. / One is impeded in his way of life./ The fat of the pheasant is not eaten. / Once rain falls, remorse is spent." . . . "The legs of the ting are broken. / The prince's meal is spilled.". . . "The ting has yellow handles, golden carrying rings." . . . "The ting has rings of jade." (This means great good luck.) "Nothing would not act to further." This idea of the pot comes from a sort of sacrificial vessel used in the Taoist ancestor cult. It is a symbol of the spiritual womb in which the new being is formed. It is the same as the krater of the early Christians, or the retort of the alchemists, in which the new being is made. Fragments of things are thrown together which do not ordinarily mix, but they unite in the fire and produce the gold, the new man. So the pot gets ears of gold and even of jade, the most valuable, the lapis lapidum, stone of stones. Here we have the same idea as in mediaeval alchemy, the lapis lapidum is the philosophers' stone. The idea that pheasants are cooked in the pot as a meal for the prince is used because that whole cooking procedure refers to the fifth line of the hexagram, the place of the Ruler. The fifth line is the gold, the prince to be made, the new man. But first one has to get the pheasant, it has to be shot. There is much hunting symbolism in the I Ching. It all means that the bundle of instincts of man, his chaotic ensemble of instincts, is not integrated at all. Instincts are most contradictory, and man is torn by them. They are like animals in a zoo, they do not love each other at all, they bite each other and try to run away. So if you want to do anything for that bundle of instincts which you are, you must hunt down your instincts, get them together and transform them. It suggests that you must collect rare things from all over the world, cook them together in the pot, and something may appear, perhaps the gold. That is the idea in the dream. There are four animals which try to escape, and they must be hunted and put into the pot. It seems to the patient that one of them is all ready to eat. The meal is ready for the perfect man. Instincts are the food to be held and transformed over the fire. This is the preparation of the prince's food. After such a process one is no longer torn by the pairs of opposites, but is at one with himself the old desideratum. Nothing is said of all this in the former dream. The design suggests that the dreamer shall go about everywhere, according to the pattern, into all four corners of the world, not only once but twice. He must make the great voyage of error in the world of illusion in order to experience everything. Everything that happens to him is himself. This voyage is the hunting, and when that is accomplished, the cooking process takes place and the making of the being who is one. pp. 107-109.

Dream [#20]

He finds himself in a hut in Africa, somewhere in the upper part of Egypt. In a corner he comes upon a crocodile and tries to chase it out, astonished to find such a beast, and somehow it disappears. Then his youngest son brings him a kettle containing all sorts of peculiar old things. He takes up a whole bundle of small scythes made, not of steel, but of sheet iron simulacra, not the real thing. Below that in the kettle he finds handles of old swords, made of metal and other material, some made even of glass, but the blades were all broken off. Below that was a statue of Christ, made of sheet iron, with a sword as long as the figure, and he notices that one can easily remove it from the statue. He wants to carry the kettle away with all its contents, but a native suddenly appears and declares that one would use all those scythes, banked up on the wall of the hut between small lamps in a sort of ceremonial. Then it dawns upon him that the hut is by no means ordinary but a kind of mosque, and the scythes are crescent moons, and he also realizes that the handles of the swords are Coptic cross symbols. page 317.

End of Dream

Concerning the contents of the kettle, he (the man) says that scythes symbolize crops, production; and swords symbolize destruction. The crescent moon would be productive while the cross, the sword, would be destructive. Within the last years, he has often thought of the extraordinary intolerance of the Christian church, suppressing, even destroying, everyone who didn't share the same opinion. But he never consciously credited Islam with a great productivity. On the contrary, owing to its dogma of Kismet, the domination of fatality, he thought that Islam belonged to the old iron, something to be thrown away. He had a feeling in the dream that he was attributing an archeological value to those contents. The lamps in the hut he associates with those you see in Islamic countries, in the mosques at the feast of Ramadan and other nocturnal ceremonies. He is astonished that this house is a mosque, a house of God, with different religious symbols that seem to be of more archeological value than materials for a cult. They are as if out of use, thrown together in a pot, regardless of their origin; the cross and crescent would not be found together naturally, they exclude each other, but here they do not hurt each other through their incongruity. page 318.

If the Yang and the Yin come together, the result is a release of energy which might be symbolized in different forms. It might be emotional energy in the case of the dreamer or it might be a burst of revealing light, an inspiration or a great vision. It is interesting to see how the unconscious, operating in the group, has already anticipated the vision. I have here a picture by a member of this group made beforehand, and so not influenced by our discussion concerning the union of the symbols. It contains a representation of what will happen when cross and crescent meet.


Image
In the drawing of the young boy on his toothbrush, we have very much the same thing. Here is the cross, then the crescent, and they are peculiarly together, and then instantly comes a tremendous outburst, a release of energy in the form of an enormous sphere of light. Such is the energic phenomenon. Here is the whole theory that when the opposites come together there will be a great manifestation of energy of some sort.


Image
Now, that peculiar light engendered by the cross and crescent is a new enlightenment, a sort of revelation. If the truth of the crescent could be united with the truth of the cross, it would produce that enlightenment, the combined truth of Islam and Christianity. If it were possible to extract the essential truth of each and blend them, then out of that clash would come an enormous illumination which would amount to a new conviction (GJS: worldview). C.G. Jung, Dream Analysis Seminar (1928-1930), pp. 417-418.


Gregory


Mon Sep 13, 2010 5:54 am
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Post Jung's Reduction of the Yin to the Anima in 1928
Thank you, Gregory, for this information.

To me it is especially interesting since some time ago I dealt intensely with Jung's reduction of the yin principle to his Anima that happened also during this time. This way he reduces the Tao, i.e., the transformation of yang into yin and of yin into yang containing higher order (= Tao) to his (3+1) quaternity. This happened in 1928, when he published his comment to Richard Wilhelm's translation of the Taoist text The Secret of the Golden Flower. As everyone can see there (his comment is also published in CW 13, §§ 1), yin becomes the Anima. Since the Anima is symbolic thinking -- this way he defined it in Psychological Types (today CW 6) -- he reduced the general feminine principle to symbolic thinking. However, the feminine principle is much more than this. It is the magic principle that I call the matter-psyche energy. In quantum physics, it is the negative energy principle that P.A.M Dirac reduced to antimatter -- also in 1928.

Thus, it seems to be a historical synchronicity -- and thus obviously this reduction (Jung's and Dirac's) had some meaning.

Today, however, we must return to the negative energy principle, to the yin principle, to the Eros Self with its inherent process that Hermetic alchemy called the coniunctio and I call the twin process [the above mentioned transformation]. This is what Carl Jung was not yet able to do. This is why he always mixed up the Anima with the anima mundi. This is why he wrote to Wolfgang Pauli:

Quote:
The problem of the coniunctio must be kept for the future; it is more than I can cope with, and my heart reacts if I exert myself too much along these lines. (Atom and Archetype, The Pauli/Jung Letters 1932 – 1958, ed. CA Meier, Springer, Berlin, 2001, p. 101)


Lets hope that this introverted procedure can help that the world will not end in a nuclear world war.

Remo

_________________
'Here stands the mean uncomely stone,
Tis very cheap in price!
The more it is despised by fools,
The more loved by the wise.'
(C.G. Jung, MDR, p. 253)
WebSite: http://www.paulijungunusmundus.eu


Mon Sep 13, 2010 4:00 pm
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Post Dreams and Synchronicities of the Other Genesis
Hi Remo, I have just finished re-reading the entire thread you started which is the same name as I have pasted into here as this post's title. There are so many important themes and developing details in that discussion among several regular forum members that I was very glad to see Kristin and Jan reviving it. I saw your 11 AM my time in Virginia post above just now close to 11:30.

This phrase you wrote really got my attention!
Quote:
Since the Anima is symbolic thinking -- this way he defined it in Psychological Types (today CW 6) -- he [Jung]reduced the general feminine principle to symbolic thinking. However, the feminine principle is much more than this. It is the magic principle that I call the matter-psyche energy.

I have been getting ready to post in a day or two about what Lee brought up recently in his direct conveying of some "spoken" terms and also by way of synchronicities that expand a theme of negative versus positive magic such as in my recent vision of his placing a gold ring on my right index finger. Actually he does not believe in practicing any kind of magic in the sense that it is usually understood -- either black or white magic. It is something else that he did with his life and some of his work and is doing now with his between the realms communications that does not involve a forceful or willful or even strongly intended beneficial manipulation of matter or mind. I do not have the words yet for this process. It is symbolic but not just symbolic, as you said, it is "much more than this. It is the magic priniciple that I call the matter-psyche energy"... but from what I grasp so far, it is not magic at all or even a form of a miracle... it is some other kind of natural supernatural process that arises from the conjoining of Logos and Eros within ourselves and more collectively with others of similar intent and sentiment. This was Lee's priniciple of "sympathetic vibration" which he had used in life to describe what he felt was our intense mental, emotional, and spiritual compatibility. RAPPORT was another word he had said to me then in 1962-63 about our seeming to be like one soul in two bodies.

My seven year old Toshiba computer just recently died. Fortunately I had an online backup storage vault and did not lose too much stuff. I replaced the old one with the cheapest Intel also a Toshiba I could find at a pre-Labor Day sale. Then my husband told me that there was another sale for dictation software this week. Because of my coordination handicap in my hands, dictation is what I need to get my old notebooks with dreams similar to yours in the early 1980s into my new computer as text to share with others here on the forum. You have mentioned hovering and moving things with magical hands in dreams. I was doing the same stuff back in the early 1980s -- including no kidding the word HOVERING that I had actually written by itself on one page for emphasis. At some point, I will have to find the date, I suddenly within an astral traveling like flying episode... said something like... "I renounce all dominion over your creation"... and bang, I floated down fast, but did not crash, to a landing with my feet on the inner ground. Around that time, the classical musician (I had met briefly in life) who had become deceased by then and who was Lee's good friend came to me in a vision and said not to go any farther into the inner realms without a trustworthy spiritual guide. Next thing I knew Lee Ayres showed up as that kindred spirit. But he and I never flew around or did fancy things. Instead we walked around in an inner landscape that could be characterised by the terms, The Garden and the Wilderness, which was an essay the real Lew sent to me later in reality after I wrote to him at the urging of Professor Leidecker, my old philosophy professor. In one scene, the inner Lew had said that something had gone wrong with the process of creation. He showed me that the beautiful garden we were strolling through was being corrupted by the introduction of something not intended to be there... it had the appearance of the infamous plant kudzu (imported into the US from elsewhere) that has taken over huge areas here while choking out other beneficial plant life. I do not have to go on about this now, as I will come up with the complete texts from the early 1980s and get them online through dictation whenever I have the time over the next few weeks.

In closing, I will just mention one meaningful coincidence that happened yesterday on Sunday afternoon. A few days after the vision last week... when Lee had placed the gold ring on my finger, and I found such a ring at a mystic meeting I went to that day... Lee asked me how I liked his gift... that I of course had to pay the $20 for myself! He doesn't have a credit card over there, he was joking, so he said... "I will pay you back. Just wait and see how it will happen." OK... how was he going to get $20 back to me? Yesterday, I was standing in line at Office Depot to get the dictation software that was on sale... I was going to get a rebate back by mail... but that would not really count as a repayment from Lee... anyhow, there I was in line waiting my turn at the cash register. Suddenly a nice lady probably 25 years or more younger than me and right in front of me in line turned and said, "Would you like to use this for your purchase?" She hands me an extra $15 off coupon she had received by mail. Sure enough, the cashier took it, and it lessened my cost. So, later at a quiet time, I said to Lee, "You still owe me $5." He replied simply, "Just wait and see how that comes to you." We will see, as it has not happened yet. I had to be exactly at the right spot at the right moment with the right lady in line in front of me... for this coincidence to happen... HOW? Whatever this process is it is something far more wonderful... a deep and radiant mystery of underlying spiritual connectedness... that is far more than mere magic or miracle. It is somehow the essence of us all if we but knew it.

For other new or old readers here at the forum, I highly recommend reading from beginning to end this topic Remo started:

Dreams and Synchronicities of the Other Genesis
http://unus-mundus.fr/viewtopic ... 70&start=0

Suzanne

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Last edited by Suzanne on Mon Sep 13, 2010 6:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.



Mon Sep 13, 2010 5:08 pm
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Post IN-flux of UFOs
Hi,

if UFOs are / have been a parallel process to nuclear activity I wonder what the next 1.5 years will bring?

Will there be more and more sightings leading up to one 'big' sighting that will IN-definitely change minds the world over?



There's an impendent nature to this thread - as if a lot is 'riding' on it.

pascal


ps - Suzanne, your "deep and radiant mystery of underlying spiritual connectedness... that is far more than mere magic or miracle. It is somehow the essence of us all if we but knew it." is amazing to me. As are many other posts and so many by Ann as well.

We've been sold 'need' when we 'need' longing. You both present a genuine longing - the kind that cannot be explained. It's inspiring me to face it, and 'teaching' me how to approach it.

That feeling needs to be presented on a large scale, it is highly effective. I can see how this would be deemed a personal association, but I think it illustrates quite clearly how change can happen. Personally, I think the 'personal' that gets injected here is basis of community.

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Mon Sep 13, 2010 5:49 pm
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Post the magical 'back picture' to this world=matter-psyche(?)
Hi All,

contemplating the material in this thread is like opening up a very rich vein of formerly hidden sensibilities. While it is true that we have touched on much of what is included here before, something tells me that this time it is happening in a slightly different way. IMO it is exactly what is needed -- an outpouring of the intensity behind our continuing personal attempts (not willed!) to knit together Indra's Net again, thus bringing eros and logos functionning into more intimate contact within ourselves. The complexity of this process is not to be trifled with, thus so many topics fit together with this one you could say that it actually in a meagre way defines the reason for the existence UM forum itself. If this seems too strong a point, I may have overstated the case, but my own sense of things now dictates that the 'now' is in fact the most important time for us to speak up, thus I say what I feel without overconcern.

Suzanne, by the sounds of your post timely messages from Lee do indeed come to the fore at present. Thought to mention in relation to the first part of your pertinent discussion: I sense that what Remo means (having done a small bit of translation/editing for him in the past) by 'magic' in regards to matter-psyche and it's functionnning, is that the matter-psyche energy is 'magiCAL', which has a somewhat different meaning than describing it as 'magic' (or 'magics' as Remo often says). In this way it could be said that matter-psyche as 'magic' in effect refers to the idea of magic in the sense of 'that which is unseen' and that which in some way or another then 'lies behind everything else'. Thus, in fact, I believe that what Remo and Lee 'discuss' really is, in the best sense, very close to having the same meaning base. Of course, I am not speaking for Remo here, or trying to guess in what way Lee means things when he directs his consciousness your way. I might as easily be wrong in my own understanding of Remo's use of the term 'magic', it would be interesting to know if I'm on the right track!

best regards to everyone,
Kristin

best,
Kristin

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Tue Sep 14, 2010 3:14 am
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Post 
well, I guess by that second 'best kristin' sign off you guys can guess the well-meaning I meant to pass on to all my fellow UM'ites, conscientiously silent or no, we're all still here hanging out together on this strange train to who knows where. These days that seems so much more important -- saying it like it is, but with compassion. It's just really impactful, the fact that this forum is still ticking. That's what I would call cool. And basically I would just like to add that I totally agree with Pascal above where he says that this sort of personal interaction, esp the kind he sees conveyed in Ann and Suzanne's most mighty blog, IS the 'basis for community'. Halleluyah.

As for the UFO business, Pascal: something is going to bust loose. It's all going to happen, probably all at once, imo. It's the grid hitting zero point, because this kind of projection cannot continue forever. I feel that the breaking point is almost upon us. There are so many signs. And it isn't that 2012 stuff that propels me to say this either, though I'm certainly not worried about being called a New Ager. That was just a smear campaign by a certain faction of society that was mortally afraid of others in society that were ready to embrace change by attempting to work on themselves until such time as fear no longer ruled their lives.

Time to walk tall, everyone: more of the same is key, 'cause nobility of soul never goes out of style!

all hail the manifesto of Love!
Kristin,

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Tue Sep 14, 2010 3:29 am
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Post Bush, Bin Laden and Luria's "tikkun"
Suzanne, Kristin, Pascal

Since I am not a native speaker, I do not know the difference between "magic" and "magical". To me, both are alike. The most important aspect is, however, that I should define what I mean with it. "Magic/magical" means a behavior that we cannot describe with the help of natural scientific (i.e., mathematical) laws, neither with the physics of Newton nor with quantum physics. It was Wolfgang Pauli, who anticipated that there must be "a third type of natural law" (See Third Type of Natural Law). This third type is behind the process that I call the twin process: Spirit-psyche (physical and/or psychic energy) transforms into matter-psyche (the magic(al) energy of the unus mundus; of the psychophysical reality beyond the split into inner and outer world, into depth psychology and physics). Then, in a parallel (twin) process matter-psyche re-transforms into spirit-psyche with altered order. This altered order is not explainable with the help of natural science. In the unconscious case this altered order has a destructive potential (Bush and Bin Laden are influenced by it !!!). In the conscious case, i.e., if there are humans who try to observe this process in their inside, the altered order is constructive. It means a higher order, in the psychophysical reality as well as in our world. Such a higher order of energy/matter we can also describe as "new life," since life is defined as exactly a higher order of the whole that one cannot explain with the help of the characteristics of the parts. Sometimes I call such a higher order also negentropy, the contrary to entropy.

Today, I am convinced that in the UFO/alien phenomenology such an altered order is created. Since the experiencers are unconscious about all this, this altered order can be constructive or destructive. Further, it seems that because of this unconsciousness no sustainability is reached. UFOs/aliens disappear in the void.

However, if people are conscious of this process, its result, the higher order or negentropy, can change the whole universe since the process is what I call psychophysically nonlocal; or with the words of Carl Jung:

Quote:
So far as I can grasp the nature of the collective unconscious [unus mundus; RFR], it seems to me like an omnipresent continuum, an unextended Everywhere. That is to say, when something happens here at point A which touches upon or affects the collective unconscious [unus mundus; RFR], it has happened everywhere.“ [Letters, vol. 1, p. 58]


Or in the words of Isaak Luria’s Cabbalah, in which Jung realized a mystical correspondence to his individuation process, discovered in empirical experience:

Quote:
With this disintegration of the Anthropos A STATE OF NON-REDEMPTION OF MAN AND GOD was created. Therefore man has the challenge of the so-called 'tikkun', the restitution of the Anthropos (God-man), ie the living universe in his wholeness. IN THIS WAY EVERY HUMAN BEING ASSISTS THE GODHEAD WITH THE REVERSAL OF THE DESTRUCTION OF THE WORLD'S CREATION ... HERE THE THOUGHT ARISES FOR THE FIRST TIME THAT MAN MUST HELP GOD TO REPAIR THE HARM WHICH CREATION HAS DONE. FOR THE FIRST TIME THE COSMIC RESPONSIBILITY OF MAN IS APPRECIATED.


Remo

PS: This is, put in a nutshell, what I have to tell the world!

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'Here stands the mean uncomely stone,
Tis very cheap in price!
The more it is despised by fools,
The more loved by the wise.'
(C.G. Jung, MDR, p. 253)
WebSite: http://www.paulijungunusmundus.eu


Tue Sep 14, 2010 9:12 am
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Post projecting entropy
Hi,

do the Bin Laden and Bush types project entropy to the world in the form of nuclear war?

I see it like this: some who are illumined are so to show the way, while others are so (with selfish awareness of entropy) and use it as a 'hand bill' of destruction? ANTI-community. It seems to have been like this since war and nuclear power were first made public as an industry.

What happens if a 'closed system' suddenly becomes wide open?? (hoping here that I have a decent grasp of entropy in a closed system 8) ) I guess I see it as self-governing / self-regulating, as the universe expands. (Soteriology?)

With respect to the 'tainted waters' idea, esp and those unaware are using that subtle communication in a negative sense by projection also. Not only by 'allowing' others to 'live' our negative traits, but also by forcing those negative traits into the 'waters' of the unconscious when enough people have dispelled fear?

Kristin, 'nobility of soul never goes out of style!' - more great input for the world's billboard...as I see it! (world's billboard = UM ??)


pascal

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Tue Sep 14, 2010 11:55 am
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Tue Sep 14, 2010 12:28 pm
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Post "premonitory" dream
Remo Roth wrote:
For the moment, however, I do not have too much hope anymore that this reunion becomes conscious. This means that I am in a great angst that mankind will end in the near future in a nuclear war. Since the constructive "luminous revelation and inspiration of a great vision" of mankind in more and more humans seems not to happen, we are in danger that the nuclear war will destroy us.

And this is the guilt of these two criminal terrorists!

Remo

PS: In the last vision before he passed away, Carl Jung had seen the world 50 years after his death. Most parts of it were destroyed ... Jung died in 1961!



"google translation" of a french text by Etienne Perrot in "CG Jung et la voie des profondeurs"

<<[...] The subject is a young woman under thirty years, occupying a position in an international context, which is entered, along with her husband in the way of alchemy of Jung.



My husband and I are part of a group surrounding a man of a certain age. We talked about a looming crisis. To support the famine which we suffer, he wants to give each of us a share of power. Then I realized he handles with long tongs of enriched uranium. I'm scared, but I see his face irradiated above the stove is not burning. they place a portion in a pewter plate that covers a layer of tin, to isolate it and he gives it to someone and then a second to a couple ... This distribution takes place in a large gathering. Then I participate in a discussion with young people. There is talk of a conflict, is unlikely to be saved, because of the current existence of nuclear weapons. It is said however that some will survive.


This dream brings together a number of themes outlined above: the impending crisis (which does not mean simply the personal life of the dreamer), stove, frequent symbol of the alchemical athanor, nuclear power symbolized by uranium (etymologically: Metal Heaven) and representing the unconscious energy (libido, Kundalini), the mastery of this energy and its integration symbolized by the tin plates. (Tin symbolizes the reconciliation of opposites. It was among the ancients, the metal welding.)

We see now flourish in more and bigger dreams featuring people "irradiated" that transmit the radiation. This has, in dreams he is a positive value. It appears radiant consciousness, as "the powder of projection made of solar atoms" spoken of by ancient alchemists. It is also often a question of preparing an antidote against atomic disintegration. This remedy is given as from uranium processing. The recipe is, you can see, homeopathic .[...]>>


Sun Sep 26, 2010 12:19 am
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