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The UNUS MUNDUS forum of Psychovision (Remo F. Roth) invites discussion of theoretical and practical issues of a possible union of Carl Jung's depth psychology with quantum physical principles.
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 Dreams of Carl Gustav Jung's Reincarnation 
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Post hogan
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Sun Nov 22, 2009 4:04 am
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Sun Nov 22, 2009 4:35 am

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Post 'death' lives at the meeting of both ends..?
First something that came to me with some deep 'knowing', like the calm that arrives with the success of a BCI or symptom/symbol transfer effect as I was just sitting here considering Jan's last couple of posts.... it was simply this: "death is kind".

This seemed to me a most brilliant insight and a great surrender at once. It came from who knows where like a gift. Yes, and this is all I should say, since it came as I was ready to post something else.. But I am weak and

need to add: I used to experience this 'burn-out' effect too with some electrical objects, just as you mentionned a couple posts above, Jan (where you said some women you know used to cause laptops to malfunction and etc. -- ). With me this effect was less intense, but still there were the wrist-watches that stopped working when I wore them, lights going out suddenly, electrical surges that would occur and etc. Also, I found I could 'jumpstart' a car that had battery problems with my sensibilities somehow. But now that I am in my hogan more often these days/years, this no longer occurs unless there is a very big build-up of energies from the outside world that has perhaps 'invaded'. Then sometimes the t.v. turns off on it's own when I am watching it and etc. I know it is an archetypal ingress then, proceed to be quite thoughtful as I know it is not 'me' anymore who is effecting these things through my electrical 'discharge', an energy which seems to stem from an unconsciousness that needs to be looked at, I believe.... So now more or less, I think that the 'vessel' of my body contains these latent energies and they do not need to 'fire off' as they once did perhaps.

Well, I guess you could say this an effect of being a sort of descending shaman type, yes... In the old days, there were both kinds of Shaman working out there, those who 'rode' up, and those who would climb down.. The horse guide usually took the shaman upwards, or they would also climb 'axis mundi' to reach the realm they wanted to access. In contrast, to access the underworld they would of course 'go down'. I wrote a rather longish post on this subject probably back in 2007 somewhere on the forum. Anyway, the usual shaman would do one or the other action where needed, either up or down, depending on what was necessary, as each person requires a different kind of healing experience from the next. There were apparently shaman though who would only do either up or down, not both. I find that interesting.. Needless to say, to my thoughts nowadays, it doesn't matter with a shaman if they go up or down, as 'up and down' do meet up at the very same place eventually -- right? :)

But for us these days in the West, the 'up' action is not a particularly good idea. We are not grounded enough to use 'up' anymore, because our will-force is in general much too strong. Just as a drug trip can drive a person into a permanent state of displacement, so too can the kundalini forced upwards do the very same. Usually too, we do not recognize that we are all the time 'going up', with our thoughts, in our big oversized emotions, our sensationalized ways... Only the shaman, one who is already sufficiently grounded, set in neutral, so to speak, can safetly attempt this 'up' motion, though of course even shamans face great danger with what they encounter in the unknown realms. Thus all this talk these days about everyone becoming a shaman all over the place is really quite amusing, sad to say.. It is not some idle thing to do, oh no.

So anyway -- the hogan, the earthed dwelling, the yurt, what have you... If we start from here, as the Hobbit does (unless we are gripped that is by a secret will force we still have not resolved!) we shall eventually connect the up with the down without even trying... But this work is always to be done from the inside out, not the other way around...

All of nature is within us. And this has some most intimate connection with the meaning of the Dead, the so-called Aliens and the UFO's, with the concept of incarnation that Remo is talking about so importantly here these last few days.. Thus, there is REALLY something rich about the words that just rose into my mind as I started this post:

DEATH IS KIND.


Kristin

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Sun Nov 22, 2009 4:53 am
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Post The End, My Beautiful Friend
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Sun Nov 22, 2009 5:24 am

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Post 
Jan

that sentence is so great --- in itself brings the EXACT necessary experience right into clear sight for me:

"we really have to find our hogan within the landscapes of the nuclear nightclub" -

Most excellent! Everything you've said on the forum shows that it is surely the case you have discovered and promoted your own elephant belly in your integrative work of the past few years (I like the red Ganesha figures you keep around the house, btw!).


Image


The timeless is within us. If we accept this, we can perhaps, by our observation alone, direct a little of this timeless unsentimental 'Nature' back out again, helping in this way to replenish the Beyond -- Issac Luria's tikkun aspect perhaps, as Remo referred to recently again...

Perhaps we help the Dead in this manner, which in turn, helps us somehow, in what way we do not know..


with good vibes,
Kristin

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Sun Nov 22, 2009 5:50 am
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Post Re: Ácephale: The Headless - positive & negative version
Junis wrote:
Suzanne,

Headless

“In the forthcoming novel Looking for Headless, the fictional author K.D. tells the story of two artists – Simon Goldin and Jakob Senneby – who initiate a collaboration with author John Barlow: Goldin and Senneby investigate an offshore company on the Bahamas called Headless Ltd., and Barlow writes a docu-fictional murder-mystery, also called “Headless”, based on these investigations. The three protagonists increasingly become entangled in the world of offshore business, while speculating about the possible connections between Headless Ltd and the secret society known as Acéphale (from the Greek a-cephalus, meaning “headless”) founded by Georges Bataille and his circle of friends connected to the Collège de Sociologie in Paris in the late 1930s.

Suzanne replies: Jan, the reason the headless item caught my eye in following the trail of the synchronicities was precisely because I remembered that you had mentioned Georges Bataille on an earlier post some months ago that I do not have time to look up now. I did a search for his name at that time. I was very disturbed to put it mildly by some of the personal life things that I read about him and his associates. It was during the period in which you appeared to be over-posting demonic (as in devilish) material over on our Ann-Suzanne Blog. I did understand that you were doing this because you were in the process of working out past trauma issues -- just as I had been in February 2008 when I first posted the picture of Dracula about to capture the semi-hypnotised girl into his dark cloak. Still, I was horrified to have the basic "high flying spiritual" message of Ann's and my Blog littered with some very freaky satanic type images that we would never use. Going from Albert Schweitzer to George Bataille and far too many mentions of Adolph Hitler's supposed "occultism" was too much of a down-swing in theme and depressing me miserably. Perhaps Bataille had in part some kind of perverse "honorable" motives, but from certain things I saw about his background, I definitely would not have wanted to know that man in person.
Quote:
Bataille shares with Sade a number of thematic preoccupations. Bataille’s fictional work, in particular Story of the Eye, is similar to that of Sade to the point of appearing derivative. As in Sade, in Bataille there is a great deal of scatology, sex scenes in churches, blasphemy, humiliation, rape, torture, and necrophilia. There are also philosophical similarities, although these have often been exaggerated. The most obvious theoretical commonality is in their ethical orientation. Sade’s view that civilization and morals have softened man is close to Bataille’s attitude (Juliette, hereafter J, 776). Both writers draw a link between the absence of God and the nullity of morality, suggesting a traditionally religious view of moral thought (Bataille’s project of founding an ‘anti-ethics’, without reason or justice, is explicitly a Godless ethics). Bataille states that Sade took the mentality of the aristocracy to its limit under the pretence of criticizing it (ER: 166). Bataille also notes that, though Sade’s work remains on the fictional plane (ER: 175; AS Vol. II: 183) he “stated his [principles] but never really put them to practice” (TE: 142). Bataille admires Sade for his nihilism and his total disregard for his fellow man, and notes that he was a “connoisseur of torture” (ER: 171-172, 189; TE: 206).

SOURCE: http://www.janushead.org/9-1/Roche.pdf

Suzanne continues: “Goldin+Senneby are interested "... but I am not, so I will skip the re-quote of the rest of that part. Jan, it was obvious to me, that when I made my polite request for you to remove some of the disturbing images from the Blog, that you very graciously did so and otherwise displayed a great deal of sincerity and integrity. Now that you have the Healing the Split, I think that will definitely aid you in developing even more safe grounding than you have already on your own in such a relatively short period of time. I always look forward to your posts now as even the sometimes disturbing items always lead forth in a positive manner to deeper understandings about confronting the troublesome impulses within our common humanity. Better indeed to confront in a courageous and yet cautious manner rather than suppress and banish them into deep recesses where they are likely to fester into worse outcomes. OK, now we move on to your present post Jan.

I did post about Bataille somewhere. While André Breton formed the political wing of the Surrealist movement, and became desidedly Marxist, Bataille tried to 'transcend' politics and the opposition of fascism and communsim all together.

Together with some friends he formed a secret society, which should be 'headless', and thus create a 'mythological' force, which would counter-act fascism, which operates cult-like on a collective level, with all the energy directed to one sole guru figure. The Acéphale review was first published on June 24th 1936, which is seen as the founding date of the secret society. This seems very significant, as the date 06/24 (Saint John's) can also be seen as a founding date of this forum (Remo's dream). And, of course, the biblical account of John the Baptist's life deals with his beheading by Salomé.

Suzanne replies: Jan, your mention of this is very significant. Of course over on the Blog I am currently posting about Leonardo and will be developing the theme that his last painting of St. John the Baptist is a Gnostic-Hermetic statement as well as the "spectre" (leading up to his death) of his own soul with the opposites united as in the Gospel of Thomas: Jesus said, "When you make the two into one, and when you make the inner as the outer, and the upper as the lower, and when you make male and female into a single one, so that the male shall not be male, and the female shall not be female: . . . then you will enter [the kingdom]." Some such works, even if not that specific Gospel, would have been available to Leonardo thanks to Pico della Mirandola and others who provided translations from Greek, Aramaic, or Arabic into Italian and Latin of earlier forbidden heretical texts to many Renaissance thinkers.

Image

There is a far more personal aspect to my interest in John the Baptist... Some months before Lee's best friend died, I got invited by the friend's wife over to see them on Lee's birthday. At that time none of us consciously knew that we all were very close to Lee as if in a common emotional and spiritual bond. I thought it was odd she had picked that date, and she did not do it on purpose, just coincidentally. Shortly before that, I had a dream about Dana where I was seeing supposedly into the future to the time of his death. One image I saw was of him in a wheelchair with his head in his lap as if beheaded. There were other details I may list another time on the Blog. Next time I talked with Lorraine, I asked how he was doing. She said he was having a relapse of his MS and was back in a wheelchair. That got my attention for sure to take the dream seriously! At the end of that vision into the future, I saw a mixed race group of people coming toward me as if in a Civil Rights March with Martin Luther King. I wrote all this down at the time. Several months later, when I went to Dana's funeral, and saw Lee again for the first time in seven years, it was the day before Martin Luther King's birthday. Another synchronicity occurred in that the evening of the day Lorraine had called to tell me Dana was dead, my tiny daughter of only 2 in age, went over to a bookshelf, took out one paperback I had never read and dropped it on the floor nearby me. The title was Invitation to a Beheading by Vladimir Nabokov. I am still decoding these Da Vinci like clues all these many years later!


Jan continues: Here's the cover image from the first Acéphale review: (and provides me with an opportunity to post a specific image I have never posted on this forum before... called ANGEL_FIRE_ALCHEMY... I do not know its origin. Suzanne)

Image Image

Maybe we need to see a "two into one" sacred marriage of these
opposite beings? Looks like they both NEED some tender loving passionate Eros!
:wink:


Jan continues: This is all very very relevant. I understand, Lee directed your attention toward Batailles secret society?

Suzanne replies: He directed my attention to the Headless concept of inner transformation from Ego-centered to Eros-centered. Batailles is a side issue. A couple of nights ago, I was consciously (not a dream at all) exploring inner realms with Lee. He said he could take me to see Dana. So, we spent about 2 hours in some very elaborate dimension shifts where I saw many images of the interweaving of all things and all beings while we somehow retain some form of specific individuality. Since I usually do not see Lee, since he says he doesn't even look the way I knew him 50 years ago any more, I asked how would I know Dana if we got to wherever he is. Lee said didn't I somehow "know" Dana and Lorraine when I first met them, so likewise now I would know Dana in his present identity by the feeling of his "presence" regardless of appearance. I have written down a lot of what happened and have collected some images but will save them for the Blog to use in about a week or so. I could have put some pictures of passageways of mirrored panels on both sides but also like windows where each led into a different time frame and dimensional locale. For now, this will do to give a loose impression of these endless alternative realities.

Image
Quote:
Jan continues: Bataille delt with the concept of a general cosmic economy of energy, which in his opinion transcended the opposition of macro-economics (world economy) and micro-economics (in this case: individual drive economies). So he was dealing with a modern collective reinauguration of the Hermetic 'As above, so below', only he wanted to keep the whole cult-related power-complexes out of the game. Hitler was also a Hermetist, just like the philosopher Ludwig Wittgenstein, but these two were certainly both caught up in a power-complex issue and related suppression of sexuality. Of course this power-complex is much more evident in Hitler. Bataille emerged form the left wing, but he truly transcended the political antagonism, and the related dialectic power-cycles to a good extent.

Maybe this means, that Lee is indicating to somehow continue his work.

Suzanne replies: Not Bataille's work. Lee's work. Remo's work.
The work of all of us here to go inward in order to find out how
to live better outwardly in harmony with all other beings.

Jan


Closing comment to All here on the forum:

Actually I do not need my friendly ghost man from the Beyond to tell me what he considered to be more important than any scientific achievements he may have had during his life. It was the "Great Work" of his own personal inner transformation that was his greatest contribution to the collective mind change needed for a better world. Let's remember that it was Lee who first read to me about Albert Schweitzer over 50 years ago when I was 18. Those were his own values. But how can I know what happened to him long after I lost all sources of information about his later years? This E-mail to Ann in late September tells how:

Well, I hardly know what to say... I was awake all night... not because I was disturbed... actually things have been much better for a few days... both at home with my husband and with the grandkids. Also, I have been feeling better, getting more things done to straighten out our home, and having some more optimism. The superficial reason for my ultra-alertness would be a combination of having taken a long nap yesterday afternoon and drinking far too much iced coffee in the evening. The result was that I found online a long article only an hour ago or so this morning about Lee's life both before and after I knew him in person. This had so many revelations about his personal character and fond impressions of him from a number of people who knew him well that I was completely overwhelmed with gratitude to know for certain these precious things about him... Various individuals in the interviews describe his extraordinary kindness... The article you will be reading shows that he was actually living the life of a gentle spirit for many years before he died. As Martha said, I loved him so much because he was a good person...

Suzanne

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Sun Nov 22, 2009 6:40 am
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Post 
Matswin wrote:
Some reflections on Remo's dream. Clearly, Jung awakes from the sleep
of death, and takes on the clothes of the living again. Arguably, why
he needs to do this is because he has left something undone in life.
This something, is connected with the symbol of destruction of
society, the coming earthquake, and he will find shelter in the
countryside. The destructive symbol could be symbolically equivalent
to world renouncement, and hence the necessity of living independently
of it, growing your own cabbage in the countryside.


Yes, Mats, this was the meaning. Remember that I had the dream 35 years ago. Since then, since 1974, I am struggling with my dreams and visions. It has much to do with loneliness, with finding my own way -- independent of all this Jungian babble of archetypes they did not really experience but are talking about like Jung's father did about the Christian God.

Quote:
According to the view of 'via negativa', as long as one partakes in
society it's really not possible to follow a true spiritual path. But
the 'via negativa' and the 'mors voluntaria' don't seem to belong in
the Jungian definition of spirituality. Of course, Jungians have this
idea of 'completeness', namely that one should be socially oriented,
and well-adapted, also. But if you read the gospels you will find that
Jesus expects his followers to renounce the world and lead a life of
poverty, so this very terse message is at the root of Christianity.
There is a cleft between Jung and the esoteric side of Christianity.


This is exactly what I criticize re modern interpretations of Jung's life by Jungians. They normalize him. Thus, for example, in Shamdasani's comment on the Red Book one does not read anything about his very, very problematic relationship with women -- his cousin Helly, Sabina Spielrein, Toni Wolff, and last not least his wife. Only of Maria Moltzer one reads, since in a book with the symptomatic title Jung Stripped Bare by His Biographers, Even [obviously an allusion on Deirdre Bair's Jung biography] Shamdasani already talked about her as the template for Jung's Anima.

Quote:
It is kind of radical, as it were, to go live in a ramshackle house in
the country. It's a life of suffering and loneliness. It could be
likened to a catastrophic earthquake in the city area, because it is a
catastrophe. For this to work it's necessary that the impetus comes
from the unconscious. But only the person himself can know this, by
looking at the dreams.


As I wrote in a post above, the impetus for writing my manuscripts always came from the "unconscious." Today I would say from the unus mundus, which is more "extended" than the (collective) "unconscious."

Quote:
Such a measure could very well represent the more earthy form of
spirituality, associated with the stomach, away from the uranic
spirit. It would imply a time of incubation, like the processes in the
alchemist's receptacle. But I know I am making an interpretation
according to my own premises.


Perfect! I realize now that this is why there is an earth(!)quake. Jung and the Jungians are not earthy enough! Only by becoming a HEADLESS we find back to this earthiness. This way, Jung can reincarnate in the "realm" of the Eros ego -- the headless ego!

Thanks, Mats

Remo

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'Here stands the mean uncomely stone,
Tis very cheap in price!
The more it is despised by fools,
The more loved by the wise.'
(C.G. Jung, MDR, p. 253)
WebSite: http://www.paulijungunusmundus.eu


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Sun Nov 22, 2009 10:00 am
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Post Re: Possession
Junis wrote:
My impression is that the animals are not mere 'archetypes, but 'realer than real' for Native Americans. I've been through some experiences of this 'realer than real' connection to the animal world, and this is certainly not merely 'archetypical'. I would call it shamanic. The outside view on this shamanic reality would then identify it as 'archetypical'.There's the animal totems, etc. which you can meet in the otherworld, and there's also a real 'communication' with animals in this physical reality. Of course, this could just be due to a difference in how we each use and understand the term 'archetype'.


Jan & All

I think that this is the point. There are "contents" of the unus mundus that are more real than real. The idea of the archetypes is still a concept that belongs to Heaven. This is why Pauli criticized Jung's quaternity as being "kept up in the heaven"

Quote:
“As long as quaternities are kept ‘up in the heaven’ at a great distance from people... no fish will be caught, the hierosgamos is absent, and the psychophysical problem remains unsolved.” [Atom and Archetype, 2001, p. 95]


NEOPLATONISM !!!

Remo

_________________
'Here stands the mean uncomely stone,
Tis very cheap in price!
The more it is despised by fools,
The more loved by the wise.'
(C.G. Jung, MDR, p. 253)
WebSite: http://www.paulijungunusmundus.eu


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Sun Nov 22, 2009 10:11 am
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Post Re: Aliens and UFOs vs. Reincarnation of Individuals
Eduard Klarer wrote:
Dear Remo

You wrote:

If we consciously accept the possibility of the reincarnation of the deceased, they come to us in dreams and visions. Like this they become individuals, and this way we have a conscious relationship with them very similar to a relationship with a living human.


This stirs me up to the question: and what when I encounter myself in a vision, in pictures (BCI, SST)? Eduard 1 (on this side of life, world) meets Eduard 2 (afterlife, otherworld, beyond). Eduard (1+2) become(s) an individual living (human) being?


Eduard

In 2006 you wrote in the thread Marie-Louise von Franz' Dream of the Return of Carl Jung, http://unus-mundus.fr/viewtopic ... light=#433 of this forum:

Quote:
A few hours ago, I treated a patient with Gua Sha (Gua Sha is a healing technique used in Asia by practitioners of Traditional Medicine, in both the clinical setting and in homes, but little known in the West. It involves palpation and cutaneous stimulation where the skin is pressured, in strokes, by a round-edged instrument; that results in the appearance of small red petechiae called 'sha', that will fade in 2 to 3 days.)

Just after the beginning of the treatment, I felt myself in a good balance and was concentrated means: I just let happen, observed and did my job. While I was working on the back of this patient it happened that Eduard 2 (see the coniunction, tree dreams [RFR: http://unus-mundus.fr/viewtopic.php?t=66]) entered into my body by my backside. Eduard 2 expanded in my (Eduard 1) body as far as my physical body is going. Then he (2) took over the job and gave Gua Sha (above) through me (1). And I (1) had just a good feeling, sensation (being happy). It seems now as if Eduard 2 found back home (into the house, body of Eduard 1).


Eduard #2 is the subtle body/soul body/body soul connected to the unus mundus/world soul/Beyond. It has entered Eduard #1 in this world and since then is the real healer. The "healer of the Beyond" begins his healing work as soon as you let go from what you have consciously learned to be TCM and let him do the work ("Just let it happen").

Remo

_________________
'Here stands the mean uncomely stone,
Tis very cheap in price!
The more it is despised by fools,
The more loved by the wise.'
(C.G. Jung, MDR, p. 253)
WebSite: http://www.paulijungunusmundus.eu


Sun Nov 22, 2009 12:37 pm
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Post Dream of Carl Jung as Merlin
After the above described dream from August 29, 1974, on September 22, 1974 I read in Marie-Louise von Franz' Jung biography C. G. Jung -- Sein Mythos in unserer Zeit [Do not know if it was published in English] in the chapter Le cri de Merlin. There, on p. 346, she describes Merlin as a "hairy anchorite."

In this moment a dream came back into my consciousness, a dream of Carl Jung I had earlier, on April 21, 1973, on the fifth month of my incredibly heavy life crisis (that had begun in Dec 1972):



Dream of Carl Gustav Jung as archaic Merlin (April 21, 1973)


I am in the garden of my birth house at Waldstrasse 1, Sulgen, Switzerland


Quote:
Association: There we children played with the girls of a family, whose name was -- WOLFRAM.

Image
Image[/align]


Suddenly C. G. Jung comes through the door of the house and approaches me:

Quote:
Association: I am always reminded of the photo below, when I think at this event. It is a photo of Jung's original, round tower. I must say, I like it much more then the other parts, especially since it is round:

Image


He looks somehow like a hairy anchorite, exactly as Marie-Louise von Franz describes Merlin on p. 346-348 in her biography. However he looks even more archaic, since also his body is fully hairy; somehow like the primitive man in the picture below.

Image

Jung begins to dance as if he was a red Indian medicine man. Then he turns to me. First he speaks in a language I do not understand at all. Suddenly, however, I have an illumination. In a state of transfiguration I begin to understand what he is talking of.

End of dream


This was a dream, I can tell you. I just had begun my analysis and thought that I cannot tell this dream to the analyst. He would not understand. Only when I read the above statement of Marie-Louise von Franz in her Jung biography, I began to understand that Merlin was meant. This would also fit to the name of the girls we played with, WOLFRAM (von Eschenbach, who wrote Parzival).

We played "hiding," and there, with about 5 years, in the dark of a little hut, I had my first erotic adventure. Only much later, after the discovery of the Eros ego/Eros Self pair as a complement to Jung's Logos ego/Logos Self pair, I began to understand that the experience of Merlin-Jung has so much to do with the principle of Eros. With Marie-Louise von Franz' dream of the return of Carl Jung to the Black Madonna in Einsiedeln (see viewtopic.php?t=76 ) I realized that Jung's reincarnation must be regarded in the context of the Eros/subtle body phenomenon. I realized that Jung comes back since the Hermetic aspect of his life is not yet integrated into his work.

Remo

_________________
'Here stands the mean uncomely stone,
Tis very cheap in price!
The more it is despised by fools,
The more loved by the wise.'
(C.G. Jung, MDR, p. 253)
WebSite: http://www.paulijungunusmundus.eu


Last edited by Remo Roth on Sun Jul 26, 2015 10:27 am, edited 6 times in total.



Sun Nov 22, 2009 2:08 pm
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During writing the above the following image of a Siberian shaman came back into my mind:

Image

Source: Joan Halifax, Shaman, The Wounded Healer, 1982, p. 64 (!):

The text:

Quote:
An oracular mirror from China, on the Siberian shaman's right shoulder, assists him in seeing the world beyond and in capturing lost souls of the dead. Hanging everywhere on his tunic are images of helping spirits. On the back he wears the symbolic bones of his own resurrection. The bells on the costume tell the shaman certain things he needs to know. The plaits, pendants and ribbons sewn to the costume are called 'tails' and 'wings', indicating the shaman's ability to fly. Other motifs that appear on the typical Siberian shaman's tunic are the rainbow, the World Tree, the Sun Door, and well defined bones and organs (Shaman's costume, Tungus, Siberia, late 18th c.)"


Remo

_________________
'Here stands the mean uncomely stone,
Tis very cheap in price!
The more it is despised by fools,
The more loved by the wise.'
(C.G. Jung, MDR, p. 253)
WebSite: http://www.paulijungunusmundus.eu


Last edited by Remo Roth on Mon Jun 18, 2012 12:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.



Sun Nov 22, 2009 2:32 pm
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I had this dream around 1968. Not sure if it has any connection - I am posting it because of the references to the head.

'I was outside time and space, about to enter existence. In front of me was a tapestry, which I was studying. A man walked across the tapestry (which came to life), and the sun was visible in the sky. Suddenly the sun became his head, and then I entered the scene and became the man.
Next, I was Picasso, standing on a beach somewhere by the Mediterranean Sea. I had been commissioned to paint Christ walking on the waters, and I felt that in order to do this work properly, I must try to do it myself. I tried to do so, and sank beneath the waves. As I sank down for the third time, apparently drowning, a beautiful silvery-green dolphin appeared. It held me in its mouth and swam back to the shore, leaving me safely on the beach.'

Patrick

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Post Interpretation of Merlin-Jung
In the thread about the Red Book[ http://unus-mundus.fr/viewtopic ... ight=#8405 ] Patrick wrote:

Quote:
There is a story told of Merlin in Geoffrey of Monmouth's 'Prophecies of Merlin', incorporated into his 'History of the British Kings'. Merlin is a magical child, born of a virgin and fathered by a daimon. King Vortigern's tower is falling down, and his druids tell him that to make it stand, he must sacrifice a pure youth. Merlin is sent for, and informs Vortigern that his druids are in error. He tells the king to dig beneath the tower. They find a pool, which they drain. They then find find two stones or vessels, containing a red and a white dragon. When released, the dragons fight, and the white dragon is victorious. The two dragons are sometimes taken as Wales and England. They are also the cause of the tower falling.
As a result of this, Merlin has a vision, and is able to describe creation, and prophesy regarding the end of the world.

And all this is part of 'The Red Book of Hergest'. Monmouth lived in the 13th Century, although he was using older traditions. So we have two Red Books. I have no idea if Jung knew of this.

R J Stewart, whom I have mentioned in a previous post, has built magical workings upon this, and relates the story I have told to the Tarot Tower. I am referring to his book, 'Merlin: The Prophetic Vision and The Mystic Life' (Arcana, 1994).

Battling snakes in a sacred Druid place, battling dragons? The dragons are powers in the land, but parallel inner energies. Maybe there is an ongoing battle in the British psyche. I don't know a lot about Jung's Red Book beyond what has been posted here, but that is my response to your [Jan's; RFR] dream. There is a great deal more about Merlin in Monmouth's book and Stewart's comentaries.


On p. 344 Marie-Louise von Franz tells this story. In her version the result of the above fight is that Uter, the real king, begins to reign Britain, and Merlin becomes his adviser. He can look through all humans and knows the future. Merlin also advices to construct Stonehenge. Then he founds the round table of the knights of the Grail. He, however, does not stay with them and withdraws into the woods, where he becomes the above mentioned Hairy Anchorite.

MLvF writes further that Merlin is the figure that continues the archetypal pattern of the archaic shaman and medicine man.

Sometimes Merlin is parallelized with Eliah -- and it was Eliah, who first spoke to Jung in his visions/auditions. Also Eliah is described as a Hairy Anchorite.

Eventually MLvF tells us that Merlin is nothing less than the secret of the Grail and of the transformative substance of [Hermetic; RFR] alchemy. In my interpretation this is what I call the matter-psyche "substance," the energy of the Beyond/unus mundus, the energy complementary to physical energy as well as to Carl Jung's objective psychic energy, the magic energy that heals on the psychophysically nonlocal level (as described above) -- what Eduard is able to let heal in the state of the Eros ego, without any conscious intention.

Thus, Merlin-Jung is not what Jungians and especially Shamdasani (p. 215-216 of the Red Book) believe Jung to be: The psychotherapist that heals psychical disease in a novel way. He is more. He is the SHAMAN, the magic healer of physical disease (what does not exclude psychic healing).

This is why in the dream of Marie-Louise von Franz Carl Gustav Jung comes back -- to the Black Madonna in Einsiedeln [ http://unus-mundus.fr/viewtopic.php?t=76 ] , and not to the C.G. Jung Institute in Zurich-Kuesnacht


Remo

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Tis very cheap in price!
The more it is despised by fools,
The more loved by the wise.'
(C.G. Jung, MDR, p. 253)
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Post HOGAN
Morning All,
I have been reading the posts and the "synchronicities" continue...........I am a "HOGAN", an introverted intuitive / feeling female whose last name IS Hogan...........
On Monday Nov 9th, in a dream, I told the daughter of my male boss that I could no longer be complaint, like a Persephone and then , still in the dream, I had a succubi on my left shoulder and as I could not get it off me, while still in the dream, I began to pray asking "God the Feminine" to pour Her light, Her love, Her blessing all over this creature ...........and this is how I awoke. ( recently I am working through a horrific Persephone experience from when I was 14............) I follow von Franz's suggestions on paying attention to the dreams ending so I have been doing LOTS of praying as more and more feelings and thoughts and visuals surface from this experience in 1968.
Wed. Nov 18th, I awoke at 1215 "feeling like von Franz was in my bedroom,standing in front of my dresser, her back to me, she seemed to be straightening the things on my dresser top and as she does this she seems to say "what is at stake here ?"........as I sit up I "hear" myself (?) say " well, the body, this body, is falling apart.....at a certain point, a person has to begin getting ready to move on".
Since this experience I continue to pray and I have stood at my same dresser examining it and noting and relating with everything that is there..........and I have been asking von Franz, "well, what is at stake here?" ( I live alone and do this "all the time", this relating with "whatever and/or whoever" ).....and I have been wondering if I am supposed to be "getting ready to move on". In this "state" that I have been in, I have ordered von Franz's books "On dreams and death" and "Alchemical Active Imagination"......feeling like they may help me out here.
The next morning, Thurs 19th, I again awoke before my alarm and as my feet touched the floor, tears began pouring as feelings /thoughts/ images engulfed me...........AND..........I felt/saw myself sink deep, deep into the earth till I reached a very very large shape/form............a warm sleeping colored woman and I curled up with her and suggled in deeper with her..........I continued to cry off and on for 3-4 hours and as I did, I continued to place myself " deep in the earth, snuggled up close, close, close"........this was the only thing that made sense to me and that helped me to get through this.
I am still feeling lots of "aftershocks" from all of this..........am "reeling" somewhat actually.......
This experience............to "go down to where the Mother makes / lays sleeping in Her bed" and feeling like I am dying without dying..............well, some "subtle" body experiences are of course not subtle!!!!! I am just trying to live sowly, focus on breathing, dishes etc..........all to keep me grounded AND as sane as possible and you know I would not have posted anything about this........I think reading Junis post on "Hogan" was what did it for me this morning. I have felt a bit more comfortable as I have been reading the various posts and also felt a growing sense of support and kinship.............I will continue reading, breathing and journeying.................my best wishes to ALL.............
Ann Marie

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Post 
Remo,

In Geoffrey of Monmouth's 'The Mystic Life', Merlin flees from the life of men to live in the woods as a wild prophet, following a terrible battle. I think that he is accompanied by a stag and a wolf. Merlin achieves the ability to see through all time as a result of the incident involving the dragons. There are changes within him brought about by the actions of the dragons. Bob Stewart has written many books on this material. Geoffrey of Monmouth is usually regarded as writing a lot of pseudo-history, but Stewart argues that it is part of an esoteric tradition.

MLvF was presumably drawing upon this and similar material.

Patrick

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Post Butterfly Synchronicity
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Post Preoccupations by youth with predatory devils...
Quote:
From Jan: Ann Marie, and all,

I just switched on my Ipod (I didn't think I would ever use one, but now I got one for my birthday). So I let the Ipod 'chose' a random title, as I felt it would be meaningful. Guess, what popped up amon more than 1200 titles? Butterfly from the Album Diamond Hoo Ha. The lyrics are very meaningful, especially if you take into account that most contemporary 'trendy' music is preoccupied if not obsessed with the devil. I used to exclusively listen to classical music and jazz, or rock music from the 60s and seventies. These are still my favorites, but with respect to the collective psyche, one has to admit, that this is 'dead music', especially among the young generation. In the 19th century opera could still be considered as 'pop music' of the time (Verdi and Puccini).

Hi Jan, I am grabbing this slot right after your last post and will be adding to it for about a half hour more. There were some things in the lyrics you quoted below that reminded me of an E-mail I sent to a few friends some days ago -- I think I have already quoted just a small smart of that E-mail on another thread, but I am going to put it in here as I go along in completing this post. I am rearranging this post an hour later because I am so scatter-brained this afternoon that I cannot seem to fit the parts of all this together better and add some videos. So, I am taking what was the bottom of this and moving it up here and farther down will give the lyrics.

Jan, something occurred to me about the One and Only as I was reading again the lyrics you gave, below the video you posted, to comment on them. Lee once said to me in the late 1950s that "rock" was not his kind of music. He loved all those stuffy dead old things like Bach. However, after I came online some years ago and got clever enough with Google searches, I began to find out that my stuffy old dead Lee is a kind of quirky hero to some young musicians. I had to really laugh at that irony of ironies. During the last year and a half that he has supposedly been communicating with me... I have wondered how he could seem to be leading me to songs at You Tube by younger bands, some of which were not even in existence when he died. I have asked him how he does this. He says part of what happens is intentional in that he is not just One on the other side but Many with him who have the same concerns about preventing human annihilation from nuclear war and/or environmental ruin. The rest of the process of the synchronicities is also a mystery to him -- especially when they involve you or Ann Marie or Patrick or Michael or Remo and many others here at the forum supplying parts of a much larger synchonicity than our separate contributions. You can see that going on all the way back up this thread and on many other threads in other categories on the forum. Anyhow, he calls it the principle of sympathetic vibration. We who are... able to interact in this way syner... duh... have to look up this word... able to interact in this way synergistically, do so because we are tuned in together to a similar Source.

syn·er·gy (snr-j)
n. pl. syn·er·gies
1. The interaction of two or more agents or forces so that their combined effect is greater than the sum of their individual effects.
2. Cooperative interaction among groups, especially among the acquired subsidiaries or merged parts of a corporation, that creates an enhanced combined effect.
[From Greek sunergi, cooperation, from sunergos, working together; see synergism.]

Jan, Here are the lyrics from which we can discern another synchronicity since they popped up as a song on your Ipod independent of your consciously choosing them as part of a theme.

Quote:
Paterfamilia
Facing the storm, right your opinions on the toilet walls
Entitled to nothing, but butterfly wings
Those little decisions could lead to anything
Well I could be crazy, if only you’d let me
If nobody tells you, you have to work it out
Wide eyed at moonrise the predator calls
It could be the last time they’ll need you anymore


The devil has left me, it’s a smack in the face
Cos when we’re together I get the sweetest taste
When I’m alone I dream in my mind of driving through space
But when we’re together I just lose my way

But say can you hear me, masters of war
Fate is a journey, see what you’re heading for
Knowledge aint easy, insanity calls
Well count yourself lucky you don’t know it all


The devil has left me, it’s a smack in the face
Cos when we’re together I get the sweetest taste
When I’m alone I dream in my mind of driving through space
But when we’re together I just lose my way

Every morning, every day of my life
Feels like the turning of a page
Without a warning there’s a change in the night
Feels like the dawning of an age


Millions of people with butterfly wings, your tiny decisions could lead to
anything

Oh

Paterfamilia
Facing the storm, write your opinions on the toilet walls
Entitled to nothing, with butterfly wings
Those little decisions can lead to anything

Millions of people with butterfly wings,
your tiny decisions could lead to anything

Looks like we can add a picture from Gregory to this that he posted
over on the Leonardo related material at the Blog. He had this label on it:

Homo Luminous?

Image


http://unus-mundus.fr/viewtopic.php?p=7947#7947

Jan, what you said above -- "The lyrics are very meaningful, especially if you take into account that most contemporary 'trendy' music is preoccupied if not obsessed with the devil." -- plus the mention of predators or what might otherwise be called psychic vampires living or dead -- brings me back around to my inner Gnostic themes in my dreams over many years.

Quote:
Facing the storm, right your opinions on the toilet walls
Entitled to nothing, but butterfly wings
Those little decisions could lead to anything
Well I could be crazy, if only you’d let me
If nobody tells you, you have to work it out
Wide eyed at moonrise the predator calls
It could be the last time they’ll need you anymore

Also, Jan, I may be mistaken, but I do not think I included the word "predatory" in what I posted on another thread of a part of what is next here. I was very surprised when Lee first mentioned this as I probably would not have come up with that word on my own. This was to three of my friends by E-mail
around the 11/11 mark. This was in reply to somebody else's statement about some folks seem to be stuck wandering around lost in a dungeon.
Quote:
Of course it is... (like a dungeon)... And so is (what Lee calls) this entire earthly "predatory realm" (based on both a literal and metaphorical eat and be eaten foundation for our existence in it), plus the numerous astral prison worlds based on various religious or occult ideologies that recycle souls back for more of the same with the belief in the necessity of karmic retribution for all our failings as the trap.

The theme is repeated over and over again in the old dream notebooks that Lee's and my mission in life was to resolve our own remaining issues and then to walk out of the prison with some others coming along with us, while similar processes are also going on among other soul groups throughout the world and beyond into other dimensions where enslavement is less obvious but very real nonetheless. It is somehow now for many an opportune time for no more cycles of return back to the same old suffering, cruelty, torture, war, and pure damn viciousness we see whenever we happen across the latest news on the Internet or TV. Lost souls are being reclaimed and led in processions to under the canopy awaiting the signal to go home --

whatever that symbolic image
may mean in ultimate reality.


As the aria in the Magic Flute said:

And when a man has faltered, it is love that shows the way.
A friend will take him by the hand...
and will guide him with joy to a better place.
A loving hand will show him the way.

Image


This is from a post some months ago and described these spirits above ready to take off...

I wrote by E-mail to Ann last year, saying that I asked Lee where are we going after I die or if this world gets blown up, and he gives various answers, however one was that "we are home" already because heaven is not a place we go to, instead it is a state of being involving various spiritual frequencies (sympathetic vibration) and dimensions according to the nature of our inner character so to speak. The transfer to whatever alternate reality we belong to or match up with can be instantaneous once we get used to no longer thinking in ordinary terms of time and space. Lee calls this process, "transformation and transcendence", and says it is not an outward journey to anywhere, rather, it is an inward journey to our own center, through our own inner core of being (heart and hara-belly), which bypasses the thought-form produced astral realms that are also another form of prison and only result in a recycling back to more suffering in the unredeemed material realm. Since here is there or there is here... depending upon our soul status... he says to make it very simple to understand, similar to "only one thing is needed" as spoken of by Meister Eckhart, just reduce all these endless complex and conflicting theories to some very basic formula along these lines: Gentle Spirits - Being Love... That is all it takes. No wings or vehicles are necessary. So, folks, get ready... get set... here we go... already Home.

Hi again, Jan, I see that you have posted something while I was bumbling around trying to complete this post. I have not read what you said yet. Later on, whenever I get around to it, I will post some videos that were provided by way of synchronicity from the words meena midge megha with dorf as a suffix to all of them... seems to make no sense... until the clues add up to something inspiring and amusing both. Fortunately, some of the departed souls still have a lively sense of humor. Suzanne

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Sun Nov 22, 2009 8:49 pm
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Post how Iung won the war
Coming back to this thread this morning a message made me wonder about this : what was the reason for Jung's first "resurrection" in 1944 ?
I thought there was a war still going on, and the 4-1 pattern in Jung's life made me wonder on which day fell a similar pattern in WW II.
It began with the invasion of Poland, at 4:30 AM German time (UTC +1 or +2) on 1st Sep 1939 . There are several dates for the end, a favorite one being the day of the speech of Hiro-Hito telling his people Japan accepted to surrender. This speech was broadcast at noon Japan standard time (UTC +9) on August 15, 1945, the first date I tried.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gyokuon-h%C5%8Ds%C5%8D
According to these dates WW II duration was exactly 2175 days, of which 4/5ths are 1740 days, and 1740 days after 1st Sep 1939 fall on 6th Jun 44, the D Day !
So the 4/4/44 Jung reintegrated life for another time of 6272 days, which would lead him to 6/6/61, exactly 17 years after the D Day.

Before I saw that, I hesitated to present what came to me from Remo's dream, here it is.
These 3 people in a hospital room reminded me of the situation in Jung's room in 1944, himself, dr Haemmerli, and Emma.
When I started my blog, I found on Google Books the Spanish translation of Jung's bio in strips, with the chapter "4/4/44" showing the 3 of them. It's no more available now, and here is the link to the page I captured, under my own responsability :
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_0GmDH7Mtnik/S ... h/44bd.JPG

The funny thing on it is the Spanish verb for the action of "standing in one's bed", incorporar...

I'm mad with numbers, and I saw in these names a Fibonacci pattern which is one of my obsessions
EMMA = 32 (A=1, B=2, aso, usw)
JUNG = 52
HAEMMERLI = 84
32-52-84 are 4 times 8-13-21, numbers of Fibonacci sequence.
Jung said Haemmerli had to die cause he used the power of a holy healer (HEILIGE HEILER) to bring him back from the dead, and his name rearranges in
H
EMMA
I
L
E
R

I had the curiosity to calculate the numerology of Remo's name, and it echoes to the values of the trio :
REMO FELIX ROTH = 51 56 61 = 168 (= 32 + 52 + 84)
The 3 values follow an arithmetic progression (51, 51+5, 51+10).
I'm striked cause I link the unit of Jung's 4-1 life, 6272 days, to the value of a sonnet by Perec, which has 168 syllables and 112 words of total value 6272 = 112 x 56.
In other occasions, Perec probably uses the number 112 as an allusion to his mother's deportation towards Auschwitz, on 11 Feb (11/2 in French) 1943.
Jung's accident was on 11 Feb 1944.
Perec uses both number 11 and 11th month November to allude to his mother's deportation, and Remo was born on 11/11/43.
REMO ROTH without the middle name = 112, and (REMO ROTH) (FELIX) = 6272.
Maybe it's just a foolish game, but I felt I had to share this.


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Post Re: Homo Luminous BCI & Father Figures
Junis wrote:
I'm starting to feel the energy to write down my HOMO LUMINOUS BCI again. I just couldn't concentrate enough on the matter priorly. I will have to delve into Egyptian Mythology and Hieroglyphic Reality a little more on the delugian matters thread before everything can come clear enough for me to properly present it on the forum.

Jan

Hi Jan, I finally finished my post above about the lyrics to the Paterfamilia video you posted. I did not read your 2 new posts since I started on that one. I do not quite get it, or do not remember it -- why is 8/13 supposed to be a negative date in multiple ways? My father's birthday was 8/12. There is a very positive association for me to the 13th I will not mention at this time. Suzanne

LINK to completed post: http://unus-mundus.fr/viewtopic.php?p=8560#8560

P.S. I should have said "Gentle Father" figure perhaps as the extra title on this post.

A bit later, I have checked and see that 8/13/09 was a positive experience day for Ann Marie that she told about in her first post at the forum...

on Aug 13, 09 I awoke from a dream where 2 women, one was colored and I knew she was my mother (not my biological mother ), spoke the number 13 to me and in my mail the same morning arrived the book "The fountain of the love of wisdom"........... http://unus-mundus.fr/viewtopic.php?p=8038#8038

Jan, I think maybe you used the word infamous for the 813 which makes it automatically negative rather than famous 813 or 8/13 which just means it is something well known like a famous person who is OK. Some kind of wicked or notorious person is usually called infamous instead of famous. So, 8/13 can continue to sound like a very lovely number to me in its significance!

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Post Archetypes
Jan - Jung used the phrase in the English translation of his UFO essay, " . . . the archetypes, which used to be called 'gods' . . ." Thus, in your dream, Jung zoo keeper is conjurer or "tamer" of the 'gods.' It has floated in my head for years that that may be the case. His death was prelude to the primary Sixties awakening & his picture top row center of Sgt. Peppers gives him the "paternal" overseer position - "Father." I'd post it but am away on a different computer.Anywy, I've posted that here lots of times as it shows the Shiva theme of rising to the "dance of life and death" and casting away the old bodies. It opened an age and Jung was "watching" in the top row. Also, his dream of Liverpool and "another Swiss" suggest dual nature and hovering over England (Liverpool the Unconscious or secondary nature or secondary face of London) which was/is about to flip External empire for Internal empire just as Rome flipped from the Caesar (Extrovert) to the Christ (Introvert).


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Post About possession or reincarnation or what - ???
Hello Jan, Again the timing of your post and my seeing it is significant. I took an evening nap and got up and found one new E-mail in it. This was odd because it had the kind of meaningful spam indications that I should look at it rather than just delete it. The first time I ever noticed this kind of "coded message" spam was right after I went one evening in March 2008 back to the street where Lee and I used to walk in 1961-62. I posted a lot on the Ann-Suzanne Blog about that evening and some photos, especially the magical Egyptian seeming one, in exchanges with Ann, Kristin, Betty, and others about the significance of it all... but NOT until over a year later on Mon May 11, 2009 8:55 am. Therefore, no one should have had the information already in March 2008 to intentionally send me the mention of Aida, a fictional Egyptian.

Image

The discussion about the possible meaning of the picture on the right began
at this specific post and went on for quite awhile and ended up with Leonardo.


LINK: http://unus-mundus.fr/viewtopic.php?p=7497#7497


One thing about the meaningful spam is that they tend to get addressed a particular way which uses two of my AOL screen names in a distinctive way that most mail coming in does not do. In the spam I received in March 2008, there were some random quotes from literature, one part using the name Aida. That is of course an opera about ancient Egypt by Verdi and has even been performed on the magnificent white (in the sun) ramps leading up to Hatshepsut's Temple in the Valley of the Kings.

The freaky thing about mention of something so specific is that even though that phrase with Aida is used in some ordinary real spam (which can be found out by Google), in this case it fit with what had just happened a couple of days before but I had not told others about yet. I wrote to Ann about this right away at the time by E-mail: "Ann... I came online a while ago to write a short E-mail to you in reply to a question you asked me about Lee. I was also going to tell you that by a chain of synchronicities, I had wound up on Monday night at a concert in downtown DC at Lisner Auditorium on 21th Street - literally on the street where I lived when I went to George Washington University - and of course where he and I used to do the walking down the block routine. I took a camera with me and a small recording device. Some very highly unusual things happened that now I have a sort of evidence for. Anyhow, before starting to write to you, I opened my spam folder to delete whatever junk the AOL filter had put in there automatically..."

I was so puzzled by this. It would almost have to have been sent intentionally by a living person who knew enough about me to fake a spam but one that would get my attention for sure. However, I could not think of anyone who would know the details needed to do that or anyone likely to have such superior psychic talents as to be able to read my mind about things I had not written or spoken about to others. I speculated some more about this to Ann: "Now, the author of this (strange spam) has one vague screen name as an E-mail address, but I know how to pull up details about addresses to trace where it came from. Then the apparent real name (which of course it is not) of the person - I will give only the first for now - is Melchiorre. Using this and other details results in a complex web of significances that finally keys in on what was called the Cult of St. John. This is something that a (Quaker by the way) man at the Smithsonian who was an expert on Leonardo Da Vinci told me would fit what I had discussed with him about my theories on what Leonardo's symbolism was in most of his paintings. He said we know he was involved with this, but we have very little information about it. He wondered how I could possibly have any notion about this whatsoever. This had to be about 30 years ago." (Correction: 40 years - early 1970s.)

GOING TO PUT SOME STUFF HERE about possession and/or reincarnation shortly... Gee, it took me quite awhile to find the old E-mail to Ann about this topic. I should stress that what is said here is part of an ongoing process of trying to get what Lee appears to say correctly. There have been many refinements in my perspective since this was written 9/1/08, but it will do to show how I was puzzling to figure out how we become obsessed with certain people, and a swirl of unwanted events may occur, and we may or may not come out of it sane and intact after such dark and stormy take-overs by unseen forces.[
Quote:
Ann, I have discussed with Lee if he and I were in effect being possessed when we met. He says that yes, the "possessing entities" (his term) that correlated with other earlier identities we (supposedly) had were the two who at first were gazing intently at each other and becoming rebonded. However, he said the real Lee and the real Sue were also relating independently of the negative entities, and it is that bond of positive companionship and love that has endured. I asked if he had consciously tried to take telepathic and empathic control of me when I was still a teenager. He said no, but that the major entity that still influenced him then, due to his involvement when first of college age with some hypnotic occult practices, was devising schemes to use us for negative purposes. He said as I no doubt remember from his frenzied and depressed behavior, after his wife became upset with him over my visit to his office and said he should never speak with me or see me again, that he also was a very confused and partially unwilling victim of this attraction between us and he suffered greatly with the anguish he felt over losing someone he had come to feel was the other part of his own soul. What he and I have been doing in our mutual meditation sessions is observing what we call "the intrusions" into our minds and emotions from these negative energies and entities, and rather than warring with them or casting them out, we either say simply no to their suggestions until they leave, or we may just silently abide safely in inner light and love, or sometimes we say something like may this other being be redeemed and transformed if it is God's will. Lee says not to worry if we are doing all this as correctly as we should, for this too is a process of discovery. As you and I have mentioned before as something to watch out for, he says whatever we say or do must be without hubris (meaning grandiose pride and inflated self-importance).

NOTE: I had mentioned to Ann about this book before, and gave a link to an article about it that I did not think was very good, because the article mentioned things Dr. Modi does NOT do and that I thought: "Some of the solutions given are probably as bad as the problem and could lead to worse bondage, but this material does bring up the topic of what 'possession' may really mean."

By the way, Jan, as you may have noticed already in the Healing the Split book you are reading now, Dr. Nelson also interviews the positive and negative voices and seeming entities. He derived in part this technique from a Dr. Wilson van Dusen who was heavily influenced by Swedenborg's views of the after-life and the varieties of good and bad angelic influence on human beings. Now back to what I was writing to Ann.


Spirit Release Work and Dr. Shakuntala Modi:

Review by somebody else: Dr. Shakuntala Modi is a psychiatrist and author of two wonderful books, Remarkable Healings and Memories of God and Creation (Hampton Roads.) I highly recommend Remarkable Healings to anyone who is interested in learning how to keep their auric field clear, reclaim lost energy due to soul fragmentation (or "soul loss"), and improve their physical and emotional health.

Better article on Modi.

"With some people, Modi uses hypnosis to have them look inside for the cause of their ailments, while with others, she uses a couple of other techniques. Some people spontaneously regress to other lives, or can see the spirits inside. Modi then converses with those spirits through the patient, and this is where all the information comes from. Modi herself does not form an opinion about the existence of past lives or spiritual entities; for her, it is more important that her methods work and her patients get better quickly. Although you can find other books about the same subject, Modi's book is very interesting because it is very comprehensive (631 pages!), well-structured and includes many case histories.

So what does she tell us about the cause of mental and physical illness? The following is a summary of what her patients told her. (Modi herself did not come up with this information.)

Some illnesses are caused by traumas in this life or in past lives. This includes birth traumas and prenatal traumas. Re-living traumatic events (the more emotional, the more effective) releases the blocked energy. Then healing can be instantaneous or may happen over the next few days.

Her patients' illnesses were usually caused by possessing or attached spirits. The pain and emotions these spirits were going through when they died were transferred, willingly or unwillingly, to the living person they became attached to or came to possess.

In these cases, medical treatment does not help. Modi calls these entities earthbound spirits, as they did not make the transition to heaven or the Light after they died. For some reason they chose to stay with a living person; usually, this was due to family ties. Sometimes they were confused; sometimes they stayed with the living person out of love; sometimes they stayed out of the desire to take revenge; sometimes they wanted to continue to feed their addictions to drugs or other substances through the person they possessed.

Some spirits are really malevolent. They are usually called dark or evil spirits, demons or devils. These are beings who have turned away from the Light and derive pleasure from harming both other spirits and living beings. We have to be careful not to condemn these beings, as they are also light beings who have covered up their inner divine light with darkness. When called upon, other angels will come and help the dark spirit to look inside. This will allow him to discover his inner light, and thereby be transformed into a light being and at the same time leave the patient.

This is not exorcism. Exorcism is the forceful removal of a dark spirit from a person. This will always fail or even cause more trouble, as the dark entity is not transformed and remains the same. So the treatment of the patient is actually a treatment of the entities that possess or are attached to the patient. They have to be convinced about what they are doing to the patient and what they really are, and that going to the Light is the best solution for them."

----------------------------

This, in the complete article below, is a lot of food for thought, and how BCI may be important to this process of inner healing, and as Remo once pointed out in one of his statements, he realized it was wrong for him to even direct a healing power to someone he was trying to help. I should look that up. That is why Lee says that we are not trying to change the (other people in our lives) for instance. Rather, if we heal within ourselves and can maintain the "Being Love" state, then those around us may begin to respond with their own inner changes. Something or other like that. The article has a second page, so click to that at the bottom of this one.

At the end of that second page, it says this, and actually tonight is the first time I have ever read this specific article although I knew a lot about Modi's work already:

"We are here to learn about ourselves and the universe, and to eventually reunite with what we call God or the Divine. Some beings have decided to go against the natural flow of the Divine in its creation, and have become dark spirits, demons, Satan. They too will eventually be transformed into light beings and reunite with God."

http://www.kajama.com/index.php?file=ar ... &PageNum=1

Lee also says that this page below about the various spiritual bodies best describes what he means when he says that the causal realm is where his true home is.(*) At this link is also mention of the Soul (permanent witness) that fits with his mention often that we are being an observer or "witness" to various inner processes and historical images that we see. Quote from site: the spiritual or causal body named also the Light body, which is the root of consciousness and the inner­most essence of the Soul.

(*)Since this was written last year, he has said home is always HERE and NOW wherever we are after we "awaken" spiritually -- so that may not make us one of those naughty earth and body denying "Neo-Platonists" like Plotinus necessarily -- although I personally do not mind the idea of moving to a less predatory realm for my next existence. :wink:

http://www.plotinus.com/subtle_bodies_copy.htm

I will post a reply at the blog in the morning only in regard to Wieman, Northhead, and Carl Rodgers. Lots of Love, Suzanne

P.S. I was going to add another fairly long quotation about how some of the possessing souls appear to come in at the time of birth or in early childhood in a very smug and superior way as if invading the inferior human. It is from one of of Dr. Michael Newton's books, Journey of Souls and Destiny of Souls, on hypnotic regression to past life and in-between life states. Some of this kind of thing may explain how even we as adults may seem to be able to channel or temporarily "incarnate" (provide a body for) other positive and negative beings. This is not fun stuff to think about. However, once there is some calm speculation and understanding without fear, the frightening implications drop away and there can be a sense of freedom in finding within us our own true selves. The Newton material I will make into a new post in a several hours after I get a long stretch of sleep.

Suzanne

_________________
"Only if a man dares to entrust himself again to the depth of his origin can he reach the height for which he was destined." Karlfried Graf Durckheim


Last edited by Suzanne on Mon Nov 23, 2009 4:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.



Mon Nov 23, 2009 7:28 am
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Post Re: Paterfamilia
Junis wrote:
By the way, when I first experienced the 'inner blossoming' linked to Ann Marie's Butterfly image, I experienced another strong synchronicity. But this synchronicity was very negative. It seemed like the shadow aspect of the butterfly effect. The problem with the butterfly effect in chaos theory is, that it is still a determinsitic (causal) model. It does deal with the limits of scientific predictability of complex systems, but it certainly does not touch the acausal nature of the 'inner radiation' and it's instanteous effects in the macrocosm, which are associated with the alchemical multiplicatio (the magic luminosity of the ruby). So in the term 'butterfly radiation', which I might have coined on that thread, there might still be a last residual of an unconscious conflict between a neoplatonic (causal) and a hermetic view of alchemy. This unconscious conflict then manifested in this shadow aspect of the butterfly effect. I am posting this, because it is very relevant to our current discussions.


Yes, Jan, this is the point. We have always to ask if we are yet in the causal/Neoplatonic way of life, or if we have completely given it up and have become Hermetic, ie acausal. The butterfly effect is in fact still causal. Only listening to the inner voice in a passive way seems to lead to the experience of what I call the inner quantum leap, the spontaneously arising image out of the belly (or also out of the heart?). Otherwise, we do black magic.

I experienced the latter with a man who had out-of-body experiences. He began to control them and had the fun to become a stalker: He went to the windows of the bedrooms of couples completely unknown to him, and observed them having sex. He was not able to let go of his will possession; and he paid with his life for this!

Remo

_________________
'Here stands the mean uncomely stone,
Tis very cheap in price!
The more it is despised by fools,
The more loved by the wise.'
(C.G. Jung, MDR, p. 253)
WebSite: http://www.paulijungunusmundus.eu


Mon Nov 23, 2009 10:56 am
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Post 
Suzanne, who made this beautiful picture with the three celestial travellers?
/Mats


Mon Nov 23, 2009 3:34 pm
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Post Dream of Jung's Resurrection from Death
The next dream re the subject of Jung's reincarnation happened on April 23, 1979:

Dream of Jung's Resurrection from Death during the May devotions for the Holy Mary

I am in the church of my youth


Quote:
Association: I was educated in the Catholic Church. Of all the services I liked most the "Maiandacht", the May devotions for the Holy Mary.
Conclusion: Already here, 30 years ago, the unconscious began to deal with the feminine aspect of "my" God-image


It is more or less at the time of Carl Gustav Jung's death, perhaps even in May (May devotions; see above).

On the other hand the atmosphere is timeless -- eternal.

During the devotion a performance of Beethoven's ninth symphony takes place. A famous conductor directs a famous orchestra. It seems to be a very solemn occasion. I do however not know what for.

But then, between the third and the fourth movement some speakers address the audience. The third speaker is Carl Gustav Jung. He looks very old and I realize that he has resurrected from death.

He begins to speak and says: Though I had much work to do in my garden, this service is important enough to me to say some words. I do not remember what he said.

Then the fourth movement begins. In it a black singer dances "fresh as a daisy" (Do not know if this is the right translation of "quicklebendig" or "quecksilbrig")

End of dream


We recognize here the same motif as in the first dream: Jung’s death and his obvious resurrection or reincarnation at the same moment. Further, the dream brings together linear time (the time of Jung’s death or shortly before) and eternal time; the time of “this world” and the time of the otherworld. This seems to be a solemn moment, and I interpret it today as the kairos, the moment in which the spontaneous incarnations like to happen. In them, eternal time and our time come insofar together, since out of the “always/everywhere,” of the Beyond, something new in our world is created. In this case obviously “a reborn C.G. Jung.”

The reincarnation happens between the third and the fourth movement. In Return of the World Soul I have shown that we cannot equalize the fourth with #4 (as usual). Instead, we have to realize that the fourth is #6 and the Seal of Solomon. It is the symbol for the unus mundus out of which the spontaneous (acausal) quantum leap (= #5 or the quintessence) happens, what leads to a “new #4”, the “new space-time,” ie new life in this world.

With the motif of the music the dream stresses first the idea of the so-called sphere music, belonging to the creation of the world (Pythagoras). Further the music stresses the quality of the first, the second, the third and the fourth. Since there is a break after the third movement, here is a very important change. In my interpretation: #1, #2 and #3 correspond to the respective qualities, the first, the second and the third. However, the fourth is not #4, but #6, the Seal of Solomon, or the bipolarity of the energy term [objective psychic energy / magic (matter-psyche) energy on the one hand and physical energy / magic (matter-psyche) energy on the other; Pauli effect]. Thus, we can conclude that the reincarnated Jung could talk exactly about this fact.

Jung would have to do in his garden. This is of course the relationship with the vegetative world. The vegetative world is a symbol of the vegetative nervous system – and in fact I read on June 19, 1976 in Jung’s Letters, Volume I, p. 258:

Quote:
There are experiences which show that the dead entangle themselves, so to speak, in the physiology (sympathetic nervous system) [vegetative ns in today’s language; RFR] of the living.


This is a further hint that Jung’s reincarnation happens on the level of the vegetative nervous system of humans, and that it is observable in the state of the Eros ego (vegetative ego).

In the fourth movement the black man dances very “quicksilvery.” As I realized during this year, dance always means incarnation, creation. It is symbolically equivalent to #5 as the quintessence, and it corresponds to what I call the (acausal) inner quantum leap.

Thus, the dream backs my conclusion that the reincarnation of Carl Jung happens in the vegetative nervous system.

Remo

[Continuation in Fukushima and Collective Sadness and following.]

_________________
'Here stands the mean uncomely stone,
Tis very cheap in price!
The more it is despised by fools,
The more loved by the wise.'
(C.G. Jung, MDR, p. 253)
WebSite: http://www.paulijungunusmundus.eu


Last edited by Remo Roth on Sun Apr 03, 2011 9:01 am, edited 1 time in total.



Mon Nov 23, 2009 4:32 pm
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Post About picture of celestial travelers
Matswin wrote:
Suzanne, who made this beautiful picture with the three celestial travellers?
/Mats

Hi Mat, Sometimes I have pictures on my computer I may have saved a long time ago. If I kept the original file name, then I can look it up and give a link to the source on the Internet. But sometimes the item just no longer exists online. So, I do not know who made it. As long as some image is not being used on a post at a money making site, rarely is there any complaint about using it in forum communications. Artists appreciate being linked to. I am on my way for a few hours with relatives passing through the area during this Holiday week. Suzanne

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Mon Nov 23, 2009 4:40 pm
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Post 
Your dream made me think of this, Remo:-

Image

The painting of the Greenman is by Courtney Davis.
http://www.celtic-art.com/

Patrick

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Nikos Kazantzakis


Mon Nov 23, 2009 4:51 pm
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Post Re: HOGAN
Ann Marie

ann marie wrote:
Morning All,
I have been reading the posts and the "synchronicities" continue...........I am a "HOGAN", an introverted intuitive / feeling female whose last name IS Hogan...........


The synchronicity seems to tell you that you have to become "a Hogan" even more. What you did in the following description.

Quote:
On Monday Nov 9th, in a dream, I told the daughter of my male boss that I could no longer be complaint, like a Persephone and then , still in the dream, I had a succubi on my left shoulder and as I could not get it off me, while still in the dream, I began to pray asking "God the Feminine" to pour Her light, Her love, Her blessing all over this creature ...........and this is how I awoke. ( recently I am working through a horrific Persephone experience from when I was 14............) I follow von Franz's suggestions on paying attention to the dreams ending so I have been doing LOTS of praying as more and more feelings and thoughts and visuals surface from this experience in 1968.


I do not know you, but I think that stressed is in fact the Goddess. In Christianity God is much too masculine (though Jesus Christ is also described as androgyne), and the feminine principle is devaluated. As you remember, in MLvF's dream I mentioned above, Jung must come back, perhaps reincarnate, at the side of the Black Madonna in Einsiedeln, Switzerland [See http://unus-mundus.fr/viewtopic.php?t=76 ]. The Holy Mary defined by the Church is not yet the complete feminine principle. Persephone and the lower part of the body are missing in it. Thus, in you exactly this black aspect of the Goddess would like to grow.

Quote:
Wed. Nov 18th, I awoke at 1215 "feeling like von Franz was in my bedroom,standing in front of my dresser, her back to me, she seemed to be straightening the things on my dresser top and as she does this she seems to say "what is at stake here ?"........as I sit up I "hear" myself (?) say " well, the body, this body, is falling apart.....at a certain point, a person has to begin getting ready to move on".

Since this experience I continue to pray and I have stood at my same dresser examining it and noting and relating with everything that is there..........and I have been asking von Franz, "well, what is at stake here?" ( I live alone and do this "all the time", this relating with "whatever and/or whoever" ).....and I have been wondering if I am supposed to be "getting ready to move on". In this "state" that I have been in, I have ordered von Franz's books "On dreams and death" and "Alchemical Active Imagination"......feeling like they may help me out here.


I experienced Marie-Louise von Franz very earthy, as a farmer's wife. In On Dreams and Death she tried to amplify the subtle body in the way Carl Jung told her, ie look at parallels in the mythology and history of mankind. Though I was very impressed by this, after some time I realized that this is a one-sided way to do so. What we have to do is to really sink into the body. Thus, "at stake" is exactly this procedure [MLvF seems to know this now]. It is what I call the Hermetic aspect of Carl Jung's depth psychology, which is more and more replaced by the Neoplatonic aspect, ie remaining in words, speaking with these figures in Active Imagination, instead of really become Persephone.

Quote:
The next morning, Thurs 19th, I again awoke before my alarm and as my feet touched the floor, tears began pouring as feelings /thoughts/ images engulfed me...........AND..........I felt/saw myself sink deep, deep into the earth till I reached a very very large shape/form............a warm sleeping colored woman and I curled up with her and suggled in deeper with her..........I continued to cry off and on for 3-4 hours and as I did, I continued to place myself " deep in the earth, snuggled up close, close, close"........this was the only thing that made sense to me and that helped me to get through this.
I am still feeling lots of "aftershocks" from all of this..........am "reeling" somewhat actually.......
This experience............to "go down to where the Mother makes / lays sleeping in Her bed" and feeling like I am dying without dying..............well, some "subtle" body experiences are of course not subtle!!!!!


This is the subtle body experience! "Subtle" does not mean "not real," but that one feels and/or sensates another reality -- the reality of the world soul/anima mundi, the reality of the beyond, the vegetative reality. In contrast to Active Imagination, where one tries to separate from the inner archetypal figures, where one confronts oneself with them, in this procedure one unifies with them ([the coniunctio!); in your case with the Great Mother.

And accepting this experience and let your soul cry and express all the other emotions, is the difference to the Jungian wish-wash about the Great Mother.

Congrats! Go on in this way

Remo

PS: The Sufis, the mystics of Islam, say: "Die before you die!"

_________________
'Here stands the mean uncomely stone,
Tis very cheap in price!
The more it is despised by fools,
The more loved by the wise.'
(C.G. Jung, MDR, p. 253)
WebSite: http://www.paulijungunusmundus.eu


Tue Nov 24, 2009 10:38 am
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