UNUS MUNDUS

The UNUS MUNDUS forum of Psychovision (Remo F. Roth) invites discussion of theoretical and practical issues of a possible union of Carl Jung's depth psychology with quantum physical principles.
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 Elephant/man and Ganesha 
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Joined: Tue Apr 04, 2006 2:56 pm
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Post Elephant/man and Ganesha
<Title edited by RFR>

I had a dream last night, I remember it being longer but I don't remember others. It was a brief dream with strong impression. I wanted to share this, what I think is an archetypal dream with our members (perhaps I still don't know what to share and what not to...) Perhaps it is related to the forum, following Remo's Blog, and others' posts...?

I saw an elephant or a man with a trunk on second thought. His head was apparently buried a while or he just made a hole in the earth using his head and trunk. I look at the earth and the hole that was made by the man/elephant. It is hemispheric with another hole in the bottom, I think--where the trunk must have made deeper hole. the earth is moist, very moist almost like fudge or caramel like in texture. I could see some watermarks on the surface of the ground/hole where the head must have been. Setting is somewhat dark.

Initially I thought my ego (earth) was gonna get holed again... I also had a brief dream some months ago about my nose growing, sharper and longer.. I also had association to the monster in the Monster dream thread.

Peace, Sang


Fri Jun 30, 2006 10:17 am
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Post 
Excellent Dream Sang!

You are 'headed' in the right direction, and your nose dream reminds me of Pinocchio, But someone with more experience should comment further, I'm still learning you know.

And I Love Your Name.

Peace Blood, Peaceful Blood.

I hope to be so peaceful someday.

Ryan

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"Let us go then, you and I,
When the evening is spread out against the sky
Like a patient etherised upon a table;"
-T.S. Eliot: The Love Song of J. Alfred Prufrock


Fri Jun 30, 2006 11:33 am
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Post The Mirror
Hey Sang,

I remembered what a dream told me once, "Every Image we see is an image of Ourselves".
If you FEEL like it, why don't you look into the mirror and share what you feel?
I remember the image Remo posted yesterday and when I looked into that mirror I knew how I felt.
It is a very "weird" experience, but it is beautiful too...I know it takes courage to be ugly...but I have always loved elephants.
I remember an image I painted once, quite by accident...it had the head of an elephant with the body of a fish...that makes me feel somehow the fish is related.

Thanks you again for sharing your dream,

Ryan

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"Let us go then, you and I,
When the evening is spread out against the sky
Like a patient etherised upon a table;"
-T.S. Eliot: The Love Song of J. Alfred Prufrock


Fri Jun 30, 2006 12:25 pm
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Post feelings..
I think my feelings were more intense, facinated by the earth, the hole, in the dream. I had a strange feeling after the dream, like being.. fertilized.
My associations lead me to searches about elephants and then to Ganesh, "the destroyer of vanity, egoism and pride" in the Wikipedia. I like Wikipedia, it is a cool tool :!: The other dreams last night were about some milk cows, I can't say much about it...
Thanks for the feedback Ryan, I explored the pinocchio part. That was interesting too.

Peace, Sang


Fri Jun 30, 2006 8:35 pm
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Post The Elephant Man
Dear Sang,

I'm Glad you mentioned Wikipedia, I use it all the time and I remember that Remo has mentioned it a few times too. Perhaps he even used it to show me what I felt to be an image of myself. I feel this to be a picture of me too.

Image

Now this is the mysterious part of the infinity of the internet: I thought I saw you today in Las Palmas, the city I have to go to sometimes to teach classes...I don't know how to explain it, but I felt it was you. You were in a car in front of me and we were both leaving a parking garage at the same time...you were driving a KIA, do you know the brand? I will show you one thing, but YOU have to follow the web, OK?

This is a Quote from Wikipedia:

Quote:
Kia was founded in 1944, and is South Korea's oldest car company. It later produced several Mazda models under licence, including the Pride (based on the 121) and Avella, which were sold in North America and Australasia as the Ford Festiva and Ford Aspire. The name "Kia" (기아, 起亞) roughly translates as "Arising from Asia" in Korean and Chinese characters.


I also recommend that you go to the disambiguation page...All the family is here with you...but this is your journey.

I can say no more.

My Best,

Ryan

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"Let us go then, you and I,
When the evening is spread out against the sky
Like a patient etherised upon a table;"
-T.S. Eliot: The Love Song of J. Alfred Prufrock


Fri Jun 30, 2006 9:38 pm
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Post 
If that's a picture of you, then you dancing with Elaine reminds me of Beauty and the Beast. :wink:

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Fri Jun 30, 2006 10:32 pm
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Post The Mirrors
Roger said,

Quote:
if I told you my life you would not believe it...


How right he is...this is so difficult in here...you think you see something, and you think it is another...but really it is yourself...or that is all I can see for the moment...These are crazy mirrors in here...yet Remo quoted (was it Bohm?) "It's Not Crazy Enough!" Talk about a Circus and I don't know if it is a Disco Ball or one of those fun house mirror rooms...where everything becomes distorted and you see yourself in shapes you've never imagined...It's Crazy...and I have a feeling it's going to get A Lot Crazier Soon...

Ryan

_________________
"Let us go then, you and I,
When the evening is spread out against the sky
Like a patient etherised upon a table;"
-T.S. Eliot: The Love Song of J. Alfred Prufrock


Fri Jun 30, 2006 10:40 pm
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Post The Beast Who is Beautiful?
Thank you Michael,

I'll look into that...it crossed my mind...but you brought it back to me...I guess that means in someway, That I am both the Beauty and the Beast...and I have to figure it out...

Thanks Again,

Ryan

_________________
"Let us go then, you and I,
When the evening is spread out against the sky
Like a patient etherised upon a table;"
-T.S. Eliot: The Love Song of J. Alfred Prufrock


Fri Jun 30, 2006 10:55 pm
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Post Correction
Remo said:

Quote:
The Crazy Theory

And now I remember the following: When, in 1957 I guess, Pauli and Heisenberg presented their theory of the world formula (Pauli rejected later) Niels Bohr criticized them:

Quote:
Your theory is not crazy enough ... !


Remo


I made this correction because I don't Understand Remo well enough,
I am some how stuck on Bohm, yet Remo obviously mentions Bohr.
Look at that little difference between the 'm' and the 'r'
I have to look into this as well...

Ryan

_________________
"Let us go then, you and I,
When the evening is spread out against the sky
Like a patient etherised upon a table;"
-T.S. Eliot: The Love Song of J. Alfred Prufrock


Fri Jun 30, 2006 11:45 pm
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Post A poem
Hello all,

Following this thread somehow reminded me of a poem I wrote a few years ago.

In Search of Meaning

This horrible search,
This quest unreasoned,
Has captured too many
A soul unseasoned

The journey of fools
I did embark
Without road map
I treaded the dark

Illusion upon illusion
I stumbled upon
Until all that was left
Was already gone

In the midst of despair
I released the clutch of hope
I found myself falling fast
Having no more rope

The abyss beckoned
Many before me
As I fell I heard the cries
Of the blind who could see

Then I heard with a roar
The name I’d been given
Found on a pearl
At once clear and hidden

The name now escapes me
Until next time I embark
The journey of fools
The quest in the dark

Clarice


Sat Jul 01, 2006 5:25 am
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Post evolution
I am thinking what would human beings look/act like in the next phase of evolution[physical negentropy, a la Remo?]. I guess we can get some hints as to how much such change mother nature has been bringing about in our world so far. I think one of the reason that we can also "save God" along with ourselves is the fact that we, as humans, are limited. We are not omnipresent for example [perhaps some of us are :?: :shock: :!: and in the intermediate world.. :?: (logos working here..) ]. I suspect that we will be limited too, once we have evolved past our current stage, in the coming age of the water carrier,...I wonder? What do you guys think?

I like what I am reading about Ganesh, about his stance for example. He keeps his one foot on the ground.
Peace, Sang


Sat Jul 01, 2006 6:10 am
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Post re: Mirror and Joseph Merrick, aka elephantman
I cracked open my copy of Ego and Archetype this morning and started reading, p 150-154. It lead to this passage:
"Truly, I say to you, as you did it to one of the least of these my breathren, you did it to me." (Matt. 25:40) :D

Peace, Sang


Sun Jul 02, 2006 6:44 am
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Post Further thoughts on Ganesh/Ganesha..
More interesting detail. if number of men is 5, counting his extremeties and head, I just thought that number of Ganesh/Ganesha would be 7, with his 2 extra arms..

It would make a great avatar,:mrgreen:

Peace, Sang


Sun Jul 02, 2006 8:02 am
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Post GANESHA
Sang

When I read the dream I liked to ask you what you associate with the elephant. Then you did: Ganesha.

From Wikipedia:

Quote:
Ganesha, in fact, is the symbol of he who has discovered the Divinity within himself.

Ganesha is the first sound, OM, in which all hymns were born. When Shakti (Energy) [RFR: Spirit] and Shiva (Matter) meet, both Sound (Ganesha) and Light (Skanda) were born.


Thus, Ganesha is the product of the king and the queen of Hermetic alchemy, the infans solaris (or the red tincture, or the quintessence). [In India, however, the spirit is femine and matter masculine. Perhaps this is a mistake; I don't know. Since Shiva is also the dance, I guess that he is energy.]

I give you further an amplification I found 24 years ago, in January 1982. It was a synchronicity. First I hit my head and had a concussion. Exactly then I found an article about Indian comics of today which deal with the Mahabharata stories.

Image

Image


The story goes as follows:

Ganesha fights against the gods. They see that they can only beat him with a trick. Thus Shiva cuts his head off. As a revenge Parvati destroys almost the whole army. To calm her down Shiva lets bring the head of an elephant which becomes Ganeshas head. Like this Ganesha was reanimated and became the son of Shiva.

Thus, it seems that the story of Ganesha belongs into some sort of world fight. The solution seems to be to cut off the head. This is of course what I try to communicate with the help of the Body-Centered Imagination.

Remo

_________________
'Here stands the mean uncomely stone,
Tis very cheap in price!
The more it is despised by fools,
The more loved by the wise.'
(C.G. Jung, MDR, p. 253)
WebSite: http://www.paulijungunusmundus.eu


Last edited by Remo Roth on Sun Mar 16, 2014 9:00 am, edited 1 time in total.



Sun Jul 02, 2006 8:22 am
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Post Ganesha and UFOs I
And now my story:

In 1995 I observed in a Body-Centered Imagination the world soul and her creative organ. The whole thing looked like the bloom of a flower [Association: Nicholas von Flue's lily = Seal of Solomon]. Out of it came something very strange: It looked like a big bullet or missile [Yes, like the ISS missile they start today in the US]. This thing oscillated [this was a very typical motion for a long time]. Then, however, it calmed down. Someone told me that I should press this thing, since there is perhaps a mechanism to open it. In fact I found something like this and a little door opened.

[I'd like to emphasize here that all this happened completely autonomously. I did not do anything, except when I was ordered to so.]

Now everything happens spontaneously. Many little manikins [today I would say cabirs] jump out, perhaps 1 cm tall. I begin to realized that they look like little Ganeshas:

Image

In this moment I remember the above quoted experience of 1982. I see especially the very big ears of these little Ganeshas.

Later I amplify Ganesha and see that his symbol is the WATER LILY:
Image

[The above is the water lily of our region, not the Eastern. I like it very much, since it has the (3+3) structure. There exists also a blue water lily, I like even more, but I don't find an image.]

Remo

_________________
'Here stands the mean uncomely stone,
Tis very cheap in price!
The more it is despised by fools,
The more loved by the wise.'
(C.G. Jung, MDR, p. 253)
WebSite: http://www.paulijungunusmundus.eu


Last edited by Remo Roth on Sun Mar 16, 2014 9:05 am, edited 2 times in total.



Sun Jul 02, 2006 9:26 am
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Post Ganesha and UFOs II
All these little Ganeshas hurry to the left. They seem to be very, very busy and happy that I have freed them from their prison. [Today I would say that they correspond to the infans solaris, red tincture, quintessence, the second goal of the unio corporalis or Holy Wedding.]

It seems that because of being in prison they are now behind with their work. I don't know exactly what they are doing. I spontaneously associate "Heinzelmännchen" (brownies, leprechauns?) with them.

A little later I see that these "Heinzelmännchen" dig black spheres out of the sand. There are infinitely many spheres hidden in the sand. They have to dig out all of them. This is why they were so busy before. It seems that it's high time for this work.

Immediately I feel that all these little black spheres are UFOs. They emanate something very powerful, but also eldritch. They look like a new army coming out of the earth.

[This is the very interesting aspect of these UFOs: They do not come down from the sky or from other universes ("extraterrestrials"), but out of the earth. Thus, they are some sort of "intraterrestrials."

Perhaps this is the difference between an unconscious UFO encounter and Body-Centered Imagination; in the latter one is conscious about the fact that all these experiences have to do with our own body and soul, or more exactly with the "body soul", the subtle body, the microcosmic aspect of the world soul, and not with so-called extraterrestrals from parallel universes.]

Remo

_________________
'Here stands the mean uncomely stone,
Tis very cheap in price!
The more it is despised by fools,
The more loved by the wise.'
(C.G. Jung, MDR, p. 253)
WebSite: http://www.paulijungunusmundus.eu


Last edited by Remo Roth on Sun Jul 02, 2006 4:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.



Sun Jul 02, 2006 9:54 am
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Post holes
It is good to hear from someone who has been there, done that, got the T-shirt, sort of speak :!: :D
Thank you Remo.
I was beginning to think that Ganesha was helping me, making (w)holes.. It is interesting to hear about Intraterrestrials :!:

Peace, Sang


Sun Jul 02, 2006 11:15 am
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Post The multiplicatio and Carl Jung's projection of the Self
At this place I had a spontaneous association. I remembered a motif in Carl Jung's UFO essay, CW 10, § 633 [6 = 3 + 3 !]. There Jung compares the many UFOs in a dream of a woman with the multiplicatio.

I'd like therefore to interrupt the description of my BCI and deal with the multiplicatio and the difference I have with Carl Jung concerning this subject.

I would say that Carl Jung's association is right (but not his conclusion; see below). The UFOs have in fact to do with the Hermetic alchemical multiplicatio, which belongs to the second goal of the unio corporalis.

As I have described in http://paulijungunusmundus.eu/hknw/holy ... _p1t_e.htm , section 4.8.2, the second phase of the opus, which is in fact the Hermetic aspect of it, has two goals. The first is the creation of the lapis (stone), of the gold, of the Seal of Solomon, and the second is the extraction of the red tincture, the birth of the infans solaris, or the creation of the quintessence.

The first goal I interpret as the union with the unus mundus which can only happen if we become some sort of Ganeshas ourselves, ie cut off our head and enter the Eros consciousness.

The second goal is the observation of what I call the singular acausal quantum leap in oneself. It is exactly what I am doing in this Body-Centered Imagination: The beginning is the connection with the world soul. Then she creates these little Ganeshas, which themselves dig out the UFOs. The latter are thus the result of the acausal quantum leap. However, also the little Ganeshas are such a second result of the Hermetic alchemical opus. They are themselves a multiplication, which produces another multiplication.

And here my difference with Carl Jung comes in. He writes in § 635 that the UFOs are "a projection of a number of psychic images of wholeness" into the sky. "Psychic images of wholeness" we can translate with Carl Jung's term "the Self." Thus he says that UFOs are a projection of the Self (or of many Selfs in this case) into the sky.

I do not agree with this argument. UFOs are not projections. They are not actually unreal phenomena. UFOs are real, and they correspond to a real creation and incarnation act of the world soul. However, we can only experience their reality with the help of the Eros consciousness. As long as we stay in the Logos consciousness, we believe however that UFOs are projections of the Self, and not real.

I can also express my difference with Carl Jung as follows: His Self -- what I call the Logos Self -- is (collective) spirit-psyche. Also his ego is (personal) spirit-psyche. Thus, Jung believes that the restricted ("non-individuated") consciousness projects contents of the Self (collective spirit-psyche) into the sky. If this restricted consciousness (personal spirit-psyche) would however deal with its archetypal dreams, it could integrate more and more aspects of the Self (collective spirit-psyche), and like this the projection into the sky would disappear.

Thus, Jung's idea is Neoplatonic in the meaning that only a transformation of collective spirit-psyche into individual spirit-psyche (et vice versa?) can take place. This is his (perhaps unconscious) idea of a depth psychological energy conservation law. It is the first, the unio mentalis phase of Dorneus' opus.

My idea is however that UFOs are the result of the second phase of Dorneus, the unio corporalis or Holy Wedding. In it spirit-psyche transforms into matter-psyche with potentially increased negentropy, and in a parallel process this matter-psyche with potentially increased negentropy transforms into spirit-psyche with realized increased negentropy.

Thus, the difference consists in the fact that for Jung UFOs are projections of the Logos Self into the Heaven, and like this the symbol of a potential transformation of spirit-psyche (collective into individual = individuation process). I, however, postulate that UFOs are the result of a transmutation in the matter of the universe (because of the artificial radioactive decay since the invention of the atomic bomb and the nuclear plants). Further I state that this is a really happening process and not a projection. It can however only be observed by the Eros consciousness (Ganesha!).

The projection is IMO that this process happens in the physical universe and even in parallel universes. Withdrawing this projection means to accept that this process happens in our own belly -- intraterrestrically so to speak.

Edit of Feb 13, 2008:
And here we come back to Ganesha above: The symbol of he who has discovered the Divinity within himself. What is meant is exactly the "Christification of many," what was Suzanne's argument at the beginning of the thread "Ann's and Suzanne's experiences' blog" ( viewtopic.php?t=721&postdays=0&postorder=asc&&start=0 )

The only chance we have today is therefore the way of the observation of these really happening transmutations in "inanimated" as well as in "animated" matter of the universe. If we do not become conscious about what happens, we are forced to observe unconsciously. We are against our will thrown into what I call the Eros consciousness in which we observe the UFOs and "extraterrestrals" in the sky. If we however become conscious about the fact that we should observe these incarnations as an inner process, we introvert and try to observe them in our belly. Like this we are able to observe the "inner UFOs" and the "intraterrestrials" in them.

Remo

_________________
'Here stands the mean uncomely stone,
Tis very cheap in price!
The more it is despised by fools,
The more loved by the wise.'
(C.G. Jung, MDR, p. 253)
WebSite: http://www.paulijungunusmundus.eu


Last edited by Remo Roth on Sun Mar 16, 2014 11:11 am, edited 5 times in total.



Sun Jul 02, 2006 11:18 am
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Post Ganesha and UFOs III
As a result of this digging out the black UFOs begin to rotate, and in the same moment they begin also to hoover.

[See also the thread Carl Jung's Pegasus Vision ... , http://unus-mundus.fr/viewtopic ... ight=#2023 ]

Amplification: Today I would amplify with the rotatio of the rotundum of Hermetic alchemy. It is a parallel symbol to the extraction of the quintessence or of the red tincture out of the lapis, the stone, or out of the gold (the gilding of the whole universe; multiplicatio; psychophysical radioactivity), or of the birth of the infans solaris as a result of the unio corporalis of the king and the queen.

The very interesting aspect of this part is that it shows that like this the initial oscillation transforms into the rotation. It is this development that chased Wolfgang Pauli very much (see http://www.psychovision.ch/synw/paujubw_e.htm#5 ), and it seems to talk of a new birth, of a creation and an incarnation act of the world soul we human beings must observe in a conscious way.

The hoovering seems to show that the whole incarnation act has to do with an antigravitative force. Today we know that the so-called cosmological constant is such an antigravitational force. Perhaps the symbolism means that as a result of the increased negentropy of the physical energy (the result of the Holy Wedding) the gravitational constant decreases. This would be in agreement with my supposition that the result of the increased negentropy of physical energy could be completely new physical laws (as the UFOs seem to show us).

But all this is speculation. Only the empirical experience of the future can show us if I am right.

Remo

_________________
'Here stands the mean uncomely stone,
Tis very cheap in price!
The more it is despised by fools,
The more loved by the wise.'
(C.G. Jung, MDR, p. 253)
WebSite: http://www.paulijungunusmundus.eu


Last edited by Remo Roth on Wed Jul 05, 2006 12:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.



Sun Jul 02, 2006 12:46 pm
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Post Ganesha and UFOs IV
The BCI goes on with a motif I begin only to understand because of visions and BCIs with a similar content of other people I know:

Every one of these little Ganeshas enters now one of these little UFOs. It seems that the purpose of the digging out was this union of the Ganeshas with the UFOs.

Then the UFOs begin to suck in something that looks like many small tails (like the ones of the comets) of yellow and reddish color.

My association was "superstrings." Today I guess because of a dream just before this BCI that here some sort of a "negative creation" is described. It seems to be a destruction of negative forces, perhaps of negative karma. Further, I know today that other people have visions, which seem to show that with the help of the BCI the negative karma of all these horrible world leaders (and of other, more ordinary people) is destroyed.

This is a very hopeful motif. It means that in the moment when the "headless" consciousness (the Eros ego) and the "rotundum" (the Eros Self) come together, the negative karma in the universe could be destroyed.

In fact in the continuation of the BCI I see a battlefield with incredibly many humans in their throes of death. A voice tells me that the "root of evil" or the "totem of evil" is destroyed like this.

Remo

_________________
'Here stands the mean uncomely stone,
Tis very cheap in price!
The more it is despised by fools,
The more loved by the wise.'
(C.G. Jung, MDR, p. 253)
WebSite: http://www.paulijungunusmundus.eu


Sun Jul 02, 2006 1:25 pm
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Post The Ganesha Synchronicity
Some days after these BCIs (it was a series) I experienced a synchronicity:

In the TV (I'm watching it very "acausally"; when I feel that it is the right moment I turn it on) I watch by chance a report of a very strange event in India:

There (in 1995) little stony Ganeshas began to drink milk when one gave it to them with a spoon. If this is "only" a fantasy or it happened really is not important in our context. The important aspect is that the Ganeshas = the beheaded liked to be fed with the lac virginis, the virgin's milk. This is however the motif with which I'd like to finish my interpretation of Carl Jung's Pegasus vision (see http://unus-mundus.fr/viewtopic ... ight=#1950 ). I was not yet able to do so, since I felt that I should first write about my Ganesha/UFO BCI as an amplification to Sang's dream.

Thus, like this the two threads come in a synchronistic manner together ...

Remo

_________________
'Here stands the mean uncomely stone,
Tis very cheap in price!
The more it is despised by fools,
The more loved by the wise.'
(C.G. Jung, MDR, p. 253)
WebSite: http://www.paulijungunusmundus.eu


Sun Jul 02, 2006 1:43 pm
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Post The UFO, Ganesha and the reincarnated Carl Jung
Some days later I feel that I should continue with this BCI. The "flower" had closed in the meantime, but now it opens anew. Again such a big "spaceship" or "missile" comes out (This time it reminds me much more of a spaceship). I do not know what I should do with it.

After a while I feel that I should open it again. I am very surprised when only one Ganesha comes out. I am even more astonished when I realize that he carries a dwarf on his back which I identify as the old Carl Gustav Jung.

I follow these two and they lead me to Jung's house in Kusnacht-Zurich. Jung gets now his normal size. In the typical stoop posture of the old Jung he enters his house.

Image

After a while I decide also to enter, but I don't find him. Finally I find him in his Turm (tower) in Bollingen. He is choping wood, as in the following photo:

Image

I thought a lot about this BCI. Finally, especially also in connection to other, similar dreams, I came to the conclusion that all this could perhaps have to do with a reincarnation of Carl Jung.

Thus, it is perhaps really true that the unus mundus and the Beyond are one and the same "realm." And the activation of the former (alchemically: the creation of the philosophical gold or of the lapis, of the "lily" or of the Seal of Solomon) leads to a reincarnation of the dead.

I'd like to emphasize once again that I experienced all this increadibly corporeally. I have never seen, neither with my patients or colleagues or in the literature a description of an Active Imagination which had this deeply corporeal aspect. This is why I decided to stress this introverted corporeal sensation aspect and to distinguish Body-Centered Imagination from Active Imagination.

Further, as one realizes, there is not one word spoken in it, and I was completely passive. Only when I got an order to do something I reacted. Thus, one could call such a BCI a "passive imagination," however without the usual negative assessment. It is the Wu Wei or the introverted Eros attitude which is emphasized in contrast to the Logos attitude of Active Imagination.

Remo

_________________
'Here stands the mean uncomely stone,
Tis very cheap in price!
The more it is despised by fools,
The more loved by the wise.'
(C.G. Jung, MDR, p. 253)
WebSite: http://www.paulijungunusmundus.eu


Last edited by Remo Roth on Sun Mar 16, 2014 9:32 am, edited 4 times in total.



Sun Jul 02, 2006 2:28 pm
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Post navigation for a new time
Hey Remo, Hi Sang -

Ganesha is for me a guide as well. The elephant is like the whale, but on land - the ultimate 'belly' image, as the leviathan, the whale, is of the waters. Therefore he/she is like the 'earth belly' , equivalent with the great mother side of the image of the world soul . The mere image of an elephant is a trigger with me for emotions which heal, for inner nourishment in every way. It is like sweetness itself - pure sattva - this beautiful beast who is so rhythmic and consistent (I feel it relates to our other thread "Monster" in this respect - elephants could be viewed by some as 'ugly' but they never never "FEEL" ugly in any way to the soul/heart self - one just has to go to the feelings, the instinct, to KNOW that they are so beautiful - fascinating that sight is not the ultimate guide - thus of course, as with the monster of 'notre dame' the so-called ugly being is ultimately yet even more beautiful...).


I'd like to add to the discussion, however on another point.

Remo said above:

Quote:
If we however become conscious about the fact that we should observe these incarnations as an inner process, we introvert and try to observe them in our belly. Like this we are able to observe the "inner UFOs" and the "intraterrestrials" in them".
(my emphasis)

Immediately upon reading this it sprang to mind that I had once had a synchronicity (somewhere on the forum - where?) that we are all 'terranauts' when we are 'doing' the personal BCI. I remember that this word - terranaut -had just come suddenly to mind due to something Remo had said at the time, and here again I have this same sense.

The 'intraterrestrials' - formerly "ET's" (now renamed by Remo due to conscious individual observation through the wu wei stance of BCI) - are these terranauts perhaps - no longer 'cosmonauts' coming out of a a linear space/time construction (born of our unconsciousness), but now navigationally important in the sense of Eros consciousness itself - in the sense of having limitless potential in an acausal sense. Remo, what speculation, and how helpful.

Isn't it so strange that we could think of the 'inner' as limitless, non-linear and therefore of the very body of the Earth in the same way - ? Many ancient teachings, such as Kabbalah for instance, have always proferred such a template - the limitless inner as being equal, in the end, to the limitless 'outer' aspect, neither of which is bounded by either space or time. Earth, or 'TERRA', herself, therefore, becomes a limitless location, directly parallel to the domain of our own inner bodies - Both those of us who connect and observe through wu wei practice and those from the 'Beyond', therefore, are in some sense 'terranauts' of the 'inner' domain, which I would equate with the unus mundus! (What a connection we must have with the 'dead', therefore... furthermore bringing to mind, once AGAIN, the 'tikkun olam' of Issac Luria - we help God/Source and all creation by our very 'actions' here on earth...)

(( quick addition: you speak too, Remo, of the 'inner UFO's' (a perfect distinction, b.t.w.) - with this I had an immediate instinct to shorten your phrase to read: " INFOS", which = we receive the 'right' info(rmation) from the 'belly', the BCI stance, because we only observe but never act unless 'ordered' to do so by the 'inner guide'. ))



Thanks for all the insights everyone...



Kristin

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Sun Jul 02, 2006 10:55 pm
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Post 2 dreams of the belly
I'm finding this discussion very interesting. I have had two dreams in succession which I think have to do with "escaping " Eros Consciousness ( which, as Remo says we are " thrown into against our will" ) in order to consciously observe the inner process through the belly.


Dream 1 June 29

I see a woman come out of her house and stand on the front step holding a bag. This bag looked like it was a sack made of flesh, skin-coloured. (I later identify the bag with her belly ) The woman looks frightened and apprehensive. I know that she wants to leave ( escape ) but is afraid. The house is completely painted in dark green camouflage. I ask if I can help. Suddenly a man comes out of the door and stands behind her right shoulder with a menacing expression. I say " is this your husband ?" to make her aware that he is there. She immediately tenses. The house seems to get taller, the front porch all but envelopes them so that I can only see their shoulders and heads and the structure gives the impression of being a tank or some kind of war vehicle.

When the dream ended I was conscious but inside the wu wei and I saw planet earth from space. Circling the planet in huge numbers were the shapes of women, all exactly the same, like the robed shape of Sophia. I was asked to "light them" ( like a healing ) and so I put light all around them, and the earth too.

Kristin tells me that Clarice had a pink suitcase when she was little she carried everywhere with her. Did this represent her belly, like the woman in my dream? Does a woman carry her belly outside of her body in case of the danger of associating too strongly with it?



Dream 2 June 30

I am walking in a new neighbourhood. I have only just "moved" here and it is "alien" to me. It is early evening and the sreet lights have just come on. There is some kind of warning siren. A woman near me gets incredibly agitated and is looking for somewhere to hide. She says that she doesn't want"them" to hurt her. That sometimes "they" kick you in the stomach ( here is the belly again). She just lies down in the grass and I do the same. "They" are a group of about five people in white one-piece suits like uniforms. They remind me of scientists. They are holding note pads and have quite large heads (Logos Consciousness). I decide to try and seduce one of them and hold my body very close to his. He shows signs of arousal and this does seem to have an effect on all of them as a unit, which makes them less aggressive toward me. They inspect us and want to see our identification.




and....

Remo speaks of the warhead that came out of the lotus and carried the tiny Ganesh figures.
I just heard about a hammerhead shark ( what animal could look more like a missile !?) which was caught recently and found to be pregnant with 55 pups , more than ever recorded.

Lisa

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Mon Jul 03, 2006 1:19 am
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Post further thoughts on Sangs 'Ganesh' dream
Hello Sang and all !

Did anyone else feel that perhaps the elephant in Sangs dream was The male principal penetrating the female principle represented by the earth? When Sang described the moist ground I made a connection to the yoni.

Strangely, yesterday I saw the rescue of a wild elephant from a mud hole on television. At first it was a little distressing to watch, but to see the huge animal recognize it was being helped and begin to work with its rescuers was so amazing. The elephant was guided out of the hole with ropes and ran away into the bush.


Lisa

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Marcus Aurelius


Mon Jul 03, 2006 1:44 am
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Post Re: further thoughts on Sangs 'Ganesh' dream
Lisa wrote:
Hello Sang and all !

Did anyone else feel that perhaps the elephant in Sangs dream was The male principal penetrating the female principle represented by the earth? When Sang described the moist ground I made a connection to the yoni.

Strangely, yesterday I saw the rescue of a wild elephant from a mud hole on television. At first it was a little distressing to watch, but to see the huge animal recognize it was being helped and begin to work with its rescuers was so amazing. The elephant was guided out of the hole with ropes and ran away into the bush.


Lisa


Hi Lisa. I had the same sense of that. I just posted a recent dream of mine also about an elelphant, and made connection to the masculine penetrative aspect.

I love your picture of the Cretan bee. I happen to have one of those with matching earrings!

Best

Frances.


Mon Jul 03, 2006 1:54 am

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Post A Love Supreme
I bought this music a while back,
but I never really heard the music until now...
He is the coal train, the A train of DUke...
but we are also Charlie Parker...
Other wise known as the bird...

This is my final interpretation:

XXX
Whisky
Smoking
Love

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When the evening is spread out against the sky
Like a patient etherised upon a table;"
-T.S. Eliot: The Love Song of J. Alfred Prufrock


Mon Jul 03, 2006 6:06 am
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Post Re: further thoughts on Sangs 'Ganesh' dream
Lisa wrote:
Hello Sang and all !

Did anyone else feel that perhaps the elephant in Sangs dream was The male principal penetrating the female principle represented by the earth? When Sang described the moist ground I made a connection to the yoni.

Lisa


I immediately had the image of some fertility rites. In some 'primitive' rural tribes in order to get generous harvests some chosen men had to penetrate the Earth and give their sperm to Her.

I can't remember the source though.

Roger

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Fire over wood:
THE IMAGE of THE CAULDRON.
Thus the superior man consolidates his fate By making his position correct.
The fate of fire depends on wood; as long as there is wood below, the fire burns above. It is the same in human life; there is in man likewise a fate that lends power to his life. And if he succeeds in assigning the right place to life and to fate, thus bringing the two into harmony, he puts his fate on a firm footing.

I Ching #50


Mon Jul 03, 2006 6:34 am
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Post amazing..
When I looked at this thread this morning, a phrase came to mind (from Kristin): "the amazing unfolding continues..". It is good to see so many female members participating..

Another phrase that came to me, perhaps more spontaneous/mysterious, which cracked me up was, "Holy Cow(s)!" I had a great laugh after that. :lol:

Good morning everyone.
Peace, Sang


Mon Jul 03, 2006 7:52 am
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Post Holy Cows is Right!
In chicago I think for the Cubs there was and announcer called...Hairy Carey or soemthing like that...what a voice he had so beautiful...he always sang (I had to make a pause here) Interesting...in the 7th inning of the Baseball came I mean game that broke my window and I was so happy to see it! VAn Morrison sang about it on his latest album Pay the Devil...I think there was a DVD but I didn't buy that one...

Love Ryan

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"Let us go then, you and I,
When the evening is spread out against the sky
Like a patient etherised upon a table;"
-T.S. Eliot: The Love Song of J. Alfred Prufrock


Mon Jul 03, 2006 12:05 pm
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Post Re: Ganesha and UFOs II
Remo Roth wrote:
[This is the very interesting aspect of these UFOs: They do not come down from the sky or from other universes ("extraterrestrials"), but out of the earth. Thus, they are some sort of "intraterrestrials."

Remo


Good people,

Not only have I encountered numerous written reports of apparently sold UFOs eminating from right out of the ground, I have also witnessed this phenomena first hand at close proximity. In the late 1970s outside of Superior, Wisconsin in the rural outback where there was (are?) constant UFO sightings & landings witnessed by the locals, on a strip of dirt road in an area where previous personal sightings had occured, I and a member of the county sherrif's department witnessed a red sphere of intense bright red light rise out of the ground about thirty feet behind my parked car... it was between 1 and 2 feet in diameter, and rose to a height about 10 feet in the air; it remained there for about 5 seconds, then descended back into the road; several seconds later it happened again.

So, while the majority of people with a pedestrian interest in UFOS view them as ariel manifestations of extraterrestrial hardware, it has been my position that we have misinterpreted them entirely due to seeing them through the Logos consciousness filter of causal science, which completely ignores the symbolic aspect of their bahavior, and is unable to comprehend the internal reality "where" they originate from.

Chris


Mon Jul 03, 2006 1:28 pm
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Post Connection with Pauli's 137 synchronicity
Chris

Thanks for posting this very informative experience and your comments.

Perhaps I could add that this world is an inner as well as an outer one, since the unus mundus, at least according to my hypothesis, does not have any metrical space, no time and there is no mass in our physical understanding of it. I described all this with the help of Wolfgang Pauli's fine structure/death room synchronicity (see http://unus-mundus.fr/viewtopic.php?t=186 , but I'm sure you have already read all this). Since there is not space, there is also no distinction between inner and outer space. This hypothesis would explain many very strange phenomena, especially also in abduction.

This "spaceless" and "timeless" (eternal) realm seems to be the background of the world of the Here and Now. Out of it, in the process I call the singular acausal quantum leap, phenomena in our world are created and incarnated. The template of this process was described by Hermetic alchemy, by the unio corporalis or the archetypal Holy Wedding (coniunctio), however without any consciousness about its acausality. To realize the latter quantum physical epistemology was necessary.

If we bring together quantumphysical epistemology, Carl Jung's experiences with the collective unconscious and the symbolism of the Holy Wedding we have created a new worldview, in which a creation according to the so-called creatio continua, the always possible creation and incarnation act (after the big bang), happens. Such incarnation acts we have to observe consciously (with the help of the Eros ego).

Remo

_________________
'Here stands the mean uncomely stone,
Tis very cheap in price!
The more it is despised by fools,
The more loved by the wise.'
(C.G. Jung, MDR, p. 253)
WebSite: http://www.paulijungunusmundus.eu


Last edited by Remo Roth on Mon Jul 03, 2006 2:06 pm, edited 2 times in total.



Mon Jul 03, 2006 2:05 pm
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Post iThe Red Ball...!
Hello Chris,

It sure is nice to meet you and thankyou for sharing with us such valuable information!
The ball is red again...that means we/I must start over from the very beginning...because there is still something we/I don't understand. I am rooting on the home tema now...Sometime one can be so silly...I hope this information serves as a warning...not only to myself, but the others in volved as well. I am thinking now...I just wrote a post about cows and so did sang as well though he wrote (s)...I wonder what that means...and hear I am interpreting again...I must be in logos...the shit...I am reminded of something Remo said about the singular quantum leap...in reference to the healer and Bohm...I'll have to look closer at that post...this trip is amazing...it never ends...

Rya n

_________________
"Let us go then, you and I,
When the evening is spread out against the sky
Like a patient etherised upon a table;"
-T.S. Eliot: The Love Song of J. Alfred Prufrock


Mon Jul 03, 2006 2:06 pm
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Post Steve Martin!
Yes,

Now I understand...Steve Martine is a wild and crazy guy...yet he has an arrow trhow his head...this is the wounding of logos...as Remo showed me with my dick! These are two aspects yet they are the same! Only in the middle between the head and dick can we exist...literally...that means literature...sot it requires words! The Oral Tradion...Shakespearr...The Lion is Growing...Yet he is gentel...This is a paradox...and like all good paradoxes...it requires that we find the middle...like Shakespera...He used consonants...like Sand and His Wife...the peaceful blood...This is the red ball...or at least that is all that I can see for now...bucause I have noone to shoow me...!

Ryan

Love

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"Let us go then, you and I,
When the evening is spread out against the sky
Like a patient etherised upon a table;"
-T.S. Eliot: The Love Song of J. Alfred Prufrock


Mon Jul 03, 2006 2:20 pm
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